4NL fire second barrel?

[bozzer]

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool (http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php) from FlopTurnRiver.com (http://www.flopturnriver.com) (Format: 2+2 Forums)

saw flop

SB ($3.73)
BB ($2.04)
UTG ($1.66)
MP ($2.24)
CO ($4.88)
Boz ($4.31)

Preflop: Boz is Button with A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP calls $0.02, CO calls $0.02, <font color="#CC3333">Boz raises to $0.12</font>, SB calls $0.11, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP calls $0.10, CO folds.

Flop: ($0.40) 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 9/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
SB checks, MP checks, <font color="#CC3333">Boz bets $0.3</font>, SB folds, MP calls $0.30.

Turn: ($1) 2/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
MP checks, Boz?

My notes and reads are as follows:

"checked TPTK on flop, bet T, check R
limped BT twice in a row"

General impression weak-tight/loose.

Oh, comments on the pre-flop too please. It felt very marginal between raising, limping, or just folding at the time. I decided I might as well raise if I was going to play.

Edit: and the c-bet. Also a bit marginal. Very dodgy hand this.

[DanJ.]

preflop is whatever, i fold there more than i raise tho.

flop is fine.
check behind on the turn, 2/images/graemlins/club.gif is a blank, so hes not folding TP to a bet, if the turn was T+ then double barrel is good.

[bozzer]

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check behind on the turn, 2/images/graemlins/club.gif is a blank, so hes not folding TP to a bet, if the turn was T+ then double barrel is good.

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I was actually thinking more in terms of kicking out that obvious straight draw he just called me with - 68, 8T etc etc. Bit silly?

[AceLuby]

At this level all of this is a spew. What is the purpose of the raise w/ Axo? Thin the field out? Build a pot?

How can villain be w/t/loose? Loose &amp; tight doesn't make sense unless he's w/t pf and w/l post flop...

Flop is meh... We are betting w/ nothing into 3 other players, I check behind.

Turn I check behind, but I would bet if I thought he would float the flop w/ overs. If he calls or raises we can dump it.

At this level bluffing is not necessary. You need to exploit these facts:

1) Players call too loosely PF
2) Players call too big of bets w/ draws
3) Players play too many draws for too many streets
4) Players will felt TPTK type hands
5) Players will call down w/ any piece of the board

There are plenty more, but you get the point. You don't exploit any of these tendencies in this hand which is why I don't like the move in general.

[Bort99]

Fold preflop. Even at 25NL a button raise with A8 is just buying a headache. Lately I've been letting hands like this go and I think variance has gotten a lot more manageable because of it.

As played, check behind. He's caught some piece of the flop and he probably won't let it go.

[bozzer]

Thanks for this. I think it's worth responding to.

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What is the purpose of the raise w/ Axo? Thin the field out? Build a pot?

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You seem to be implying that neither of these answers are correct, but this is exactly why I raised, plus to get FE on the flop.

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How can villain be w/t/loose? Loose &amp; tight doesn't make sense unless he's w/t pf and w/l post flop...

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I didn't make this very clear. I wanted to express that he's moderately loose preflop - I'd guess around 30VPIP, but is weak-tight postflop.

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Flop is meh... We are betting w/ nothing into 3 other players, I check behind.

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Have you heard of a c-bet? You'll have to give more reason than that to not bet here, surely?

[AceLuby]

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Have you heard of a c-bet? You'll have to give more reason than that to not bet here, surely?

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Trust me, I c-bet almost every board that I raise PF with, but at these stakes with this many players and the fact that you have A high, weak kicker would make me more inclined to check behind. I understand what you are trying to do here, I just don't think it's that profitable at this level.

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You seem to be implying that neither of these answers are correct, but this is exactly why I raised, plus to get FE on the flop.

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At these stakes you are only building a pot w/ a mediocre holding which is a very good way to spew chips. Almost no one is going to fold because 'hey, it's only ten cents more'. I also doubt your FE is much better on the flop. I've tightened up my game for uNL because my big hands will get paid off. I would fold this PF. Also, if you hit anything less than 2 pr you are probably not good and don't have any FE. This may work better for even higher stakes uNL, but in 4NL I think this is spewing chips.

If you want to 2nd barrell it, go ahead, but don't be suprised by a call w/ 2nd pair or better. This is why playing your strong hands strong is so profitable at uNL.