Vampires and Crosses? [Archive] - Two Plus Two Newer Archives

diebitter

02-05-2006, 05:55 AM

A vampire jumps you and you somehow form two sticks into a cross, and she runs away screaming.

I see 3 possible reasons for this:

1) It actually contains the power of God/Jesus and is physically damaging to the vampire to touch/see
2) The cross has become a receptacle of good thoughts and worship, and possesses a power 'of good' in and of itself. This is damaging/painful for the vampire.
3) You are exploiting the vampire's belief system against him, and the cross contains no intrinsic powers

Are there other possible reasons? If you could get a hold of a bunch of vampires from anywhere in the world as lab rats, how would you test these ideas?

My thoughts are that if you can disprove 2 and 3, you have potential proof of Godhead. But maybe I've missed some possible explanations.

MidGe

02-05-2006, 05:57 AM

What's with your prejudice against vampires, dude? /images/graemlins/smile.gif

diebitter

02-05-2006, 06:00 AM

I'm just not happy about someone sucking my blood, is all. Call me Mr Picky /images/graemlins/grin.gif

hmkpoker

02-05-2006, 06:06 AM

Vampires are repulsed by crosses and other holy symbols.

This is generally false. However, if the wielder of the symbol has great faith in the power it represents, a vampire may suffer ill effects from the brandishing of the symbol. Vampire: the Masquerade 3rd edition corebook, pg. 23

This doesn't apply if the character takes the optional 7 point True Faith merit, which adds +1 to all willpower and virtue rolls, provided a humanity score of 9 or higher.

soon2bepro

02-05-2006, 06:28 AM

May I remind you that true vampires do exist ("desmodus rotundus", or "Vampire bats") and they're no more afraid to a holy cross than to any other symbol formed from the same material. You might as well wave a pentagram at them to drive them away.

hmkpoker

02-05-2006, 07:35 AM

I think I'd rather run. By the time a vampire has learned bat form (Protean level 4), he can already pop claws that deal Strength +1 aggravated damage.

Nut4Dawgs

02-05-2006, 09:23 AM

pssst, diebitter. There's a couple of guys here who seem to know waaaaaay too much about vampires. Look at the times on their posts. Man, they know this stuff!

Me, I'm not takin' nooooo chances around here.

<ul type="square"> http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a200/Nut4Dawgs/Thread%20Pics/vc11.jpg [/list]

Peter666

02-05-2006, 11:10 AM

I don't think a simple cross would repulse a vampire because this shape is found all over the place, mostly without religious signifigance. To really repulse a vampire, you would need a crucifix.

diebitter

02-05-2006, 11:11 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think a simple cross would repulse a vampire because this shape is found all over the place, mostly without religious signifigance. To really repulse a vampire, you would need a crucifix.

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay it's a crucifix that happened to be in your pocket. Sheesh.

guesswest

02-05-2006, 11:12 AM

A gun would probably work too.

soon2bepro

02-05-2006, 11:16 AM

LOL...

I found that REALLY funny guesswest /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

madnak

02-05-2006, 12:57 PM

There are many many other possible considerations. Perhaps the innate power of the cross predates Christianity. Or part of the creation process for vampires somehow makes them vulnerable. Or the cross has a specific biological effect on the vampire that has nothing to do with God. Or your very belief that crosses repel vampires drove the vampe away. Or there was a vampire killer standing behind you and that was why the vampire ran away, you just thought it was the cross. Or a powerful being decided to make vampires vulnerable to crosses as a joke, because he thought Christianity was absurd and wanted to be ironic. Or maybe the cross contains special body thetans that want to inhabit the vampire.

I think there are an infinite number of hypothesis. In fact, I'd bet that there's some recursive method that can be used to generate them.

Myrmidon

02-05-2006, 10:56 PM

The legand goes that Cain, after he was banished to the land of Nod, met up with Adam's first wife, Lilith. Different stories disagree whether Cain was the 1st vampyre. Or one of his three sons was the first vampyre. The 2nd son being the first lycon. The 3rd son did nothing of importance, loser. It is the blessing on the cross that effects vampyres and not the shape itself. Vampyres are afraid of crosses because vampyres are entirely part of the xtain story. Logically, they can't be sperated. Beleif in one should mean belief in the other.

DcifrThs

02-05-2006, 11:47 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'm just not happy about someone sucking my blood, is all. Call me Mr Prickly /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]
FYP

Barron

madnak

02-06-2006, 12:30 AM

Legends of vampires predate Christianity by quite a bit.

BCPVP

02-06-2006, 12:42 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Legends of vampires predate Christianity by quite a bit.

[/ QUOTE ]
So does Cain. By about 6,000 years. What's your point?

madnak

02-06-2006, 01:00 AM

I mean in other myths in other cultures. The basic idea of vampires has probably been around longer than human civilization. It's hardly "entirely part of the xtian story." On the contrary, Christianity just recycled the old myths (as usual).

BCPVP

02-06-2006, 01:24 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I mean in other myths in other cultures.

[/ QUOTE ]
FWIW, it sounds like the guy you quoted was being facetious because it sounded like he was paraphrasing Underworld.

[ QUOTE ]
The basic idea of vampires has probably been around longer than human civilization.

[/ QUOTE ]
How is this possible?

madnak

02-06-2006, 12:16 PM

For those of us who trust archeological evidence, it is clear that myth predates civilization.

guesswest

02-06-2006, 12:30 PM

I don't understand that either madnak - perhaps you can help me understand what you mean. I kinda get how the objects of myth could possibly predate humanity - but surely the word 'myth' refers to a human experience, and additionally the ability to transfer those beliefs from person to person. How can we have that without human civilization?

timotheeeee

02-06-2006, 12:50 PM

I think this wins the Weirdest Thread Award, to be given out at a beautiful ceremony in downtown San Jose tonight at 7pm.

madnak

02-06-2006, 01:23 PM

Keyword civilization. Civilization has been around for about 6000 years. Humans have been around from 30,000 to 500,000 years (depending on your estimates and your definition). Artifacts and sculpture have been unearthed from at least 12,000 BC (8,000 years before the dawn of agriculture).

tomdemaine

02-06-2006, 05:16 PM

I think the real question is, does sign of the cross fingers work?

diebitter

02-06-2006, 06:02 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I think this wins the Weirdest Thread Award, to be given out at a beautiful ceremony in downtown San Jose tonight at 7pm.

[/ QUOTE ]

you don't look in OOT, do you /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Nut4Dawgs

02-06-2006, 07:05 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think this wins the Weirdest Thread Award, to be given out at a beautiful ceremony in downtown San Jose tonight at 7pm.

[/ QUOTE ]

you don't look in OOT, do you /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe a distinction could be made here.

"Weirdest Thread for Thimkers Award"

<font color="white"> that's not a typo </font>

tyrus72

02-06-2006, 07:50 PM

(4) Vampires hate vector calculus and the cross horrifyingly reminds him of the cross product.

You've only missed an infinite number of explanations. Keep trying your "proof".

Edenfield99

02-08-2006, 12:58 PM

There is an old Marty Feldman sketch where he plays a Jewish Vampire, he sneaks up on his victim and shows a cross and he says something like "Geesh, have you got the wrong Vampire"

diebitter

02-08-2006, 02:43 PM

[ QUOTE ]
There is an old Marty Feldman sketch where he plays a Jewish Vampire, he sneaks up on his victim and shows a cross and he says something like "Geesh, have you got the wrong Vampire"

[/ QUOTE ]

That's Alfie Bass in 'the fearless vampire killers'

morphball

02-08-2006, 02:43 PM

The Vampire myth is universal...I saw a TV interview with Count Dracula, he said everyone has known about his crazy tactics for quite some time. He also said crosses don't work and that he is quite fond of garlic.

(First sentence is serious...I was into Vampires at one time..)

12AX7

02-09-2006, 01:25 AM

Oh for crying out loud. Is this really a post? LOL!

It works because the fiction writers penned it in. LOL!

jman220

02-09-2006, 02:02 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Vampires are repulsed by crosses and other holy symbols.

This is generally false. However, if the wielder of the symbol has great faith in the power it represents, a vampire may suffer ill effects from the brandishing of the symbol. Vampire: the Masquerade 3rd edition corebook, pg. 23

This doesn't apply if the character takes the optional 7 point True Faith merit, which adds +1 to all willpower and virtue rolls, provided a humanity score of 9 or higher.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sengir Vampires are 4/4 and can fly.

BCPVP

02-09-2006, 02:07 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Vampires are repulsed by crosses and other holy symbols.

This is generally false. However, if the wielder of the symbol has great faith in the power it represents, a vampire may suffer ill effects from the brandishing of the symbol. Vampire: the Masquerade 3rd edition corebook, pg. 23

This doesn't apply if the character takes the optional 7 point True Faith merit, which adds +1 to all willpower and virtue rolls, provided a humanity score of 9 or higher.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sengir Vampires are 4/4 and can fly.

[/ QUOTE ]
They get +1/+1 when they kill stuff, right? Been a looooong time since I played...

hmkpoker

02-09-2006, 03:39 AM

jman220

02-10-2006, 12:34 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Vampires are repulsed by crosses and other holy symbols.

This is generally false. However, if the wielder of the symbol has great faith in the power it represents, a vampire may suffer ill effects from the brandishing of the symbol. Vampire: the Masquerade 3rd edition corebook, pg. 23

This doesn't apply if the character takes the optional 7 point True Faith merit, which adds +1 to all willpower and virtue rolls, provided a humanity score of 9 or higher.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sengir Vampires are 4/4 and can fly.

[/ QUOTE ]
They get +1/+1 when they kill stuff, right? Been a looooong time since I played...

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, they were awesome.