I need help ... badly

[SoCalPat]

I gotta find a way to handle the endless runs of suckouts and bad beats.

Usually, when this happens, I'm a complete ass, berating players and the like. Wise-ass remarks will send me over the edge. I'd like to think that my play isn't affected that much. Preflop, not much changes, but I probably disregard odds and the probability that I'm beaten more than I actually realize. I don't know how many times I've called to get a showdown just so I could show the donkey on the other end just how lucky he got.

Tonight, however, I was on a mission. To lose the final $150 (after starting the day at $320) in my Paradise account. That amount didn't truly represent my entire bankroll, as I'm regularly making deposits. I'll be the first to say I win more than most, but not nearly as much as I could.

I moved up from .5/1 HE and 1/2 draw to 3/6 SH HE to ensure this would happen as quickly as possible. And sure enough, the bad beats and compromising turn/river cards came, and poof ... I was done. First, catching a third 10 on the turn, only to lose to a boat, then getting into a raising war PF with 92 suited on my final hand. I think I was drawing dead on the turn.

I'm constantly telling myself that there's no need to berate, that you're better than most out there -- a Stewart Smalley act if you will. And it works for a half dozen sessions or so, then the blowups come again.

Would a psychiatrist help? Books? I need something, because I'm too good to allow my emotions to destroy my game ... as well as my reputation, although in the online world, I'm wondering if there's much I can do to restore that. Or maybe I'm just not that good to begin with, although I'd like to think being up nearly $15K since the beginning of 2004 is good for something -- two seconds in multis for a total of $2,100 "inflates" that number somewhat, though, as it pertains to the overall total.

If you need to know more before you can give a reasoned answer, boardmail me. I'm pretty much open to anything right now. I'm a mess.

[Allinlife]

i really think there should be a sticky saying "Buy Inside the poker mind"

stop tapping the glass plz

[Max Weinberg]

I actually emailed Party Poker and asked them to revoke my chat priveleges permanently.

I've toned down lately, but I suppose you can always do... uh... that.

It's pretty extreme though.

[StaticShock]

[ QUOTE ]
That amount didn't truly represent my entire bankroll, as I'm regularly making deposits. I'll be the first to say I win more than most, but not nearly as much as I could.

[/ QUOTE ]

Regularly making deposits yet winning more than most, eh? Sounds like you have a pretty damn high opinion of yourself as a poker player for someone who goes on complete monkey tilt TRYING to lose their roll. I think you need to get your head seriously straightened out before you deposit again.

[StaticShock]

If my last post came off as harsh, well, I meant for it to. I cannot stand jackasses at the table berating other players. Ranting and raving only shows psychological weakness to the other players. If you can't realize that bad beats are part of the game then maybe poker isn't an activity for you.

[SoCalPat]

[ QUOTE ]
Regularly making deposits yet winning more than most

[/ QUOTE ]

Deposits into my Firepay account, or withdrawls from my Paradise account. After last night, I'll be deposting money into Paradise for the first time since June 2005 -- when I only emptied the account because I was moving across the country.

Agreed with you on the rest, and hold no ill will toward the severity of it. I need to be slapped around.

[raze]

[ QUOTE ]
I cannot stand jackasses at the table berating other players. Ranting and raving only shows psychological weakness to the other players. If you can't realize that bad beats are part of the game then maybe poker isn't an activity for you.

[/ QUOTE ]

Handling the beats is a key skill in becoming a profitable/great player.. just like knowing to raise with AA

[ottsville]

[ QUOTE ]
Tonight, however, I was on a mission. To lose the final $150

[/ QUOTE ]

That's the attitude! Next time you feel this way, PM me, I want to be at your table.

[ QUOTE ]
I'm constantly telling myself that there's no need to berate, that you're better than most out there

[/ QUOTE ]

If that is true, than why do you feel the need to berate others? If you are truly better, your play should speak for itself. The need to berate is usually a sign of poor self confidence and weakness(not to mention just a jackass move and a way to ruin a good game).

The best advice I've heard on tolerating suckouts was this: <font color="blue"> The player that stays in when he doesn't have the odds, when he's longshot to hit his hand, is exactly the player you want at your table because he makes those mistakes. He will suck out on you from time to time; congratulate him and know that you will get the money back later, usually with interest.</font> The mistake most players make is playing weak hands and staying too long right? Isn't that what the suckout artists are doing? Yet you know that it is a mistake on their part. For advice on playing in a loose passive game, read Psych of Poker by Schoonmaker...he's got a good section on those types of games(there's a good mathematical example with the return on AA vs few and many players).

The bigger issue...are you the type that blows up in outside of poker as well(it's often hard to separate our personalities real life/poker for most players)? Does it bother you in real life? Are you high strung?

Finding a way to relax, center yourself, and deal with anger may help you. There's lot's of self-help books out there. A therapist may be a good choice is the DIY avenue is too daunting(I've seen several people here strongly recommend them and I probably would too). Learning to meditate or some type of relaxation exercise may help as well. A lot depends on how serious you are about changing your behavior.

[DrVanNostrin]

What evidence do you have that you're a winning player? (I'm not denying that you are I'm just wondering).

[SoCalPat]

I could show you my bank and Firepay statements from 2004-present if you'd like.

[.Alex.]

[ QUOTE ]
The best advice I've heard on tolerating suckouts was this: <font color="blue"> The player that stays in when he doesn't have the odds, when he's longshot to hit his hand, is exactly the player you want at your table because he makes those mistakes. He will suck out on you from time to time; congratulate him and know that you will get the money back later, usually with interest.</font>

[/ QUOTE ]
The best I've heard is,
"It's a good thing if people suck out on you more than you suck out on them. It mean's you're getting your money in as a favorite more often."

[Tien]

Quit poker forever.

You are losing more money to stupidity than bad beats. Add up all the times you made the incorrect decision, and you will see how badly these mistakes compound to your losses.

And dont give me that "well he made the stupidest decision to follow me to the river with gutshot, 2 outer, 5 outer". You clearly have said how many times you call when you know you are beat.

[SoCalPat]

[ QUOTE ]
Quit poker forever.

[/ QUOTE ]

Whoa there turbo. First, I'm not a quitter. Second, while you give good reasons for quitting, the problem with your description of me is that you presume I'm like that 100 percent of the time. I'm not.

I'm just looking for advice to reduce my tiltish tendencies.

[12AX7]

Well, let's see...

You make money at it, but it's driving you crazy.

Sounds like you need to make a career decision. /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Either the aggravation is worth the profit, to you, or it isn't.

If it is, sounds like you have enough experience and profit to say you're winning. So just keep that in mind. When you get sucked out on, just tell yourself, "OK whacknut... I'll be gettin' you dough... sooner or later..."

[James Boston]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm too good to allow my emotions to destroy my game

[/ QUOTE ]

I only play poker as a hobby, and I'm not claiming to be that good.

With that said, the above quote makes no sense. I know what you're trying to say, but stop and think about it. If anything is capable of "destroying your game," then you're not "too good."

If you're a winning player as long as things are going your way, but tilt your money away when they're not, maybe stop playing when you get upset. Then if you find yourself having to stop playing more often than continue playing, you may need to re-evaluate whether or not poker is for you.

[GambleGamble]

I moved to Vegas and became playing pretty regularly at that point (up til then it was home games and the occasional trip to a card room) and I had the same problem I was playing solid but would get sucked out and lose it, not necessarily going off on the indiviudal but generally making snide comments to goad the person etc.

I rarely lost overall but those hands just got to me, mostly because I didnt know any better, but the a couple of old hands I got to know basically sat me down and did the old "don't rattle the fish, it kills it for the rest of us deal" and I also just got used to and realized eventually they are gonna leak out there profit and a little more usually so in the end its a positive for myself.

And I always play the hand back in my mind and realize in most cases its a TERRIBLE pre flop call, that leads into normal calls that one should make but I can't over look the cold call 2 with 9/10 suited that hits the straight flush to crack my full house.

Just remember in the long run when surrounded by a table of donkeys dont turn into a jack ass

[Dave H.]

Not trying to toot my horn, just wanna help...

Thoughts On Tilting (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=0&amp;Number=4612993&amp;an=0&amp;page=1# Post4612993)

[Howard Beale]

You may have some technical poker playing knowledge but you do not know how to play winning poker. In order to play winning poker you have to attempt to make the best decision possible for the current situation and then you must actually DO it. The rest just happens. If you have acted properly in a hand/game/session/series of session you will win sooner or later. You don't expect to win EVERY time do you? The casinos don't expect to win every time. They don't even WANT to win every time. They want their regular players to win, they wan't them to come back. If they come back the casino knows they will win eventually. It's the same with poker. When you play you don't have a mortal lock you only have an edge. And that's all you need: an edge. Applied over many trials it makes you a winner but you should bear that in mind: MANY TRIALS!

Now stop acting childish. Keep your mouth shut and your fingers away from the keyboard when you play and don't be upset when things happen that are supposed to happen.

You started your post with "I gotta find a way to handle the endless run of suckouts and bad beats." Since there is nothing you can do about them I say you should ignore and forget them.

[FCBLComish]

There are 2 parts to playing good poker, skill and discipline. There are literally hundreds of thousands of players who have the skill, but not the discipline to play the game profitably over the long haul. Too many people focus on the former, and ignore the latter.

[mroels]

[ QUOTE ]
then getting into a raising war PF with 92 suited on my final hand. I think I was drawing dead on the turn.


[/ QUOTE ]

What was the other guy holding to give you a bad beat here?