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View Full Version : QQ as an over pair. Post flop

VorShot
12-10-2006, 04:57 PM
<font color="blue"> BB is 48/15. He likes to fire with air a lot post flop. </font>


Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.05/$0.10
6 players
Converter (http://www.neildewhurst.com/hand-converter)

Stack sizes:
UTG: $9.15
VorShot: $14.25
CO: $14.40
Button: $6.40
SB: $9.55
BB: $16.60

Pre-flop: (6 players) VorShot is UTG+1 with Q/images/graemlins/club.gif Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif
UTG folds, <font color="#cc0000">VorShot raises to $0.4</font>, 3 folds, BB calls.
<font color="blue"> Standard i assume. </font>

Flop: 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif T/images/graemlins/spade.gif ($0.85, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">BB bets $0.6</font>, VorShot calls $0.6 <font color="aaaaaa">(pot was $1.45)</font>.
<font color="blue"> BB bets right out for less then the pot. I decide to call for two reasons. He loves to bet with nothing, and a raise here will end the hand. Other reason, I'd like to keep the pot small with queens until i have more information since we're semi deep stacked. </font>

Turn: 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif ($2.05, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">BB bets $0.8</font>, <font color="#cc0000">VorShot raises to $2.65</font>, BB calls.
<font color="blue"> Ok, so now there is a flush draw and a hand like 76 just got there, and BB has fired again, but it's now so small compared to the pot, i decide he's not trying to get value out of a made hand, and if he's betting small to make me raise, he did a good job. If he 3-bet here i'd be worried, but a call doesn't make me feel to special either. </font>

River: J/images/graemlins/heart.gif ($7.35, 2 players)
BB checks, VorShot...
<font color="blue"> So that J made a possible straight for 97, and a hand like JT just passed me. I really have no idea where i'm at in the hand because i'm not sure what he can call the turn with. Are there any hands that call a bet here that i beat? River play here would be helpful. I beleive our effective stacks here on the river is around $10.</font>
wslee00
12-10-2006, 05:25 PM
just check behind on the river. Based on your reasoning, I guess you can make a case for calling the flop, but I still raise it anyway just in case he has something.
VorShot
12-10-2006, 08:41 PM
No one else has any comments?
Marshall28
12-10-2006, 08:51 PM
id raise his bet on the flop. it likely wont end the hand if he holds a 10, but you have a lot more information for later rounds. you see you get real confused on the river because you didnt raise the flop.

at higher limits i wouldnt mind making a play like calling the flop, but the fact of the matter is, you cant put villain on a hand, cuz he could have anything since he doesnt know what hes doing, AND villains at these limits will stack off with such weak hands that there is no point to try to play it sneaky. they dont know either way.
el_dusto
12-10-2006, 09:00 PM
if he's raising with air, you have to reraise to figure out whether or not he's got it /images/graemlins/smile.gif and i'd say all worse hands fold to a river bet, so just check behind.
Phytopath
12-10-2006, 10:53 PM
I bet more on the flop, but yeah I just check this through on the river.
SirNeb
12-10-2006, 11:11 PM
AT or KT is the most likely his holding. Players this level will hold on to their top pair like it's their life. River check makes no sense for a made hand(straights), btw on the flop 67s is a possibility. Don't overlook that.
SCBielski
12-10-2006, 11:26 PM
OK, there is a very good chance you are ahead here and are up against a hand like Q10, K10, or A10. At these stakes, I'd say the check is because the J on the river actually scared him a little. I would try to get a little bit of value out of this hand, a bet like $2.50 would be good; this bet is small enough that it will get paid off by top pair and is also small enough to get away from if he pushes all in over you. I doubt he will make a move here with air or a weak hand even if you make a wear bet. I'd be interested to see the outcome of this hand because I play these stakes sometimes and I almost always see an opponent like this at the table. V-bet, holla.
VorShot
12-11-2006, 12:13 AM
[ QUOTE ]
btw on the flop 67s is a possibility. Don't overlook that.

[/ QUOTE ]

I mentioned it.
InfectorGadget
12-11-2006, 12:22 AM
He could have most anything though, the turn could have given him a straight draw (if he has 23, 36, w/e) or a flushdraw. Either way the river is a scare card to him if he has a T, so I dont think youll get much value from that hand, I guess he most likely will call though its not always a T he is holding.

I like to check behind for those reasons that I just see you lose alot or gain little by betting here.

And I reraise the flop too I think, even if he bets with just air, you cant give him a free card to a A or K, so Id like to raise for protection too, though its not unreasonable to just call with your read.
gimmetheloot
12-11-2006, 12:26 AM
V, these, IMO, are the spots that will take your winrate from 2ptbb/100 to 7 or 8ptbb/100...i dont know what yours is, but you get the point.

I think you can squeeze another 35 BB of value out here, though, admittedly, it is fairly thin. If he checkraises you, please let it go.