Annie Duke book

[Disc_Golf]

Browsing Amazon and saw that this comes out in about a week. Does anyone have any info on it?

thanks.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1594630127/ref=pd_luc_23_lc_ax40_r2c2_a2_i/104-0031325-1648718?v=glance&s=books

[thetman]

How I beat a table full of superior players was the 2nd choice I assume?

[greatwhite]

Maybe she is good author, but she's the most overrated player on the planet. I don't know if I can trust everything that she says.

[Noo Yawk]

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe she is good author, but she's the most overrated player on the planet. I don't know if I can trust everything that she says.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your extensive playing time with her must have shaped your opinion. Could you list a few hands that you've played against her, so I can see how overated she is?

[mike4bmp]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Maybe she is good author, but she's the most overrated player on the planet. I don't know if I can trust everything that she says.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your extensive playing time with her must have shaped your opinion. Could you list a few hands that you've played against her, so I can see how overated she is?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah...I think it is hard to judge any player by what you see on TV. Collectively, we've probably seen her play maybe 50 hands....not enough to determine if she is good or not. Also the people doing the editing for broadcast choose hands that the pros would not want displayed.

[Depalma]

Well, her tutoring of Ben Affleck is well-publicized. At least from what has been said publicly, she helped him go from a weak player to a decent or better player.

Also, I remember seeing during the WSOP last year that Brett Jungblutt said that she taught him how to play Omaha Hi/Low and now he has a bracelet.

Now, these stories can be overblown, but there is at least some evidence out there that she can teach the game. Now if she is able to put to properly communicate thos teachings in written form, this book may have value.

I'll wait to reserve my judgment until after the book is released.

[benfranklin]

I read a advanced copy of the book and don't recommend it. It alternates chapters, switching back and forth between her biography and a narrative of the WSOP game when she won a bracelet. The bio was not the kind of stuff I have any interest in, or ever read myself. The stuff about her growing up in a very competitive family, very into games, has been covered elsewhere. She also had a lot of problems with anxiety throughout her life. Again, I find this kind of stuff boring. At the risk of being crude and insensitive, this is the kind of stuff women like to read.

The account of the WSOP is also uninteresting. The game was O/8, which I play, but is boring to people who don't play it. I don't remember that there was a good explanation of the game for those not familiar with it, but there may have been. I found very little insight into poker as a game or into the professional life. There were a couple of interesting tidbits I remember. Annie plays cash games with her own money, but is 100% backed in tournaments by Eric Seidel. Also, she and Chris Ferguson trade 5% of winnings in tournaments.

The copy I have is an advanced reading copy, and not the final edition There were numerous errors in it concerning poker, which may have been corrected. One I remember was a description of a heads-up pot where her opponent called her raise, and she then reraised. There are many little things like that. She had a co-author, so it is possible that he made the errors and she hadn't done her final read of the text. There are also little tips on poker scattered through the text which are very basic.

The best thing in the book is an add-on chapter at the end describing the big superstar invitational she won. There is some good stuff there about about poker, particularly some good insight about strategy, and how Lederer changed his playing style during the game as he saw how the game was developing, and how she saw what he was doing and did the same thing, allowing her to win. However, this is old material and has been on her website for some time.

[benfranklin]

[ QUOTE ]


Now, these stories can be overblown, but there is at least some evidence out there that she can teach the game. Now if she is able to put to properly communicate thos teachings in written form, this book may have value.

[/ QUOTE ]

I consider myself to be a good but not expert O/8 player. I learned nothing about the game from her book. It is not a strategy book, except for the little tips scattered through the text, which are of little value. She does have some very good strategy artilces on her web site.

[Depalma]

Like I said, IF she can translate those teachings to paper. It sounds like she didn't even try. Which is why I said, I would reserve my opinion until after the book is released.

My main point, however, was to point out that she is reputed to be a capable teacher and was directed at the poster who felt that, because he feels that she is an overrated player, that he can't trust what she has to say.

[BluffTHIS!]

Since she learned everything about poker she knows from Howard Ledherer, why would anyone want to read her regurgitation of his teachings rather than just learning from his books and videos? I mean, would anyone buy a poker book from someone who learned how to play from 2+2 books and then wrote their own book that didn't contain any new insight? Oh . . . nevermind.

[Depalma]

[ QUOTE ]
Since she learned everything about poker she knows from Howard Ledherer, why would anyone want to read her regurgitation of his teachings rather than just learning from his books and videos? I mean, would anyone buy a poker book from someone who learned how to play from 2+2 books and then wrote their own book that didn't contain any new insight? Oh . . . nevermind.

[/ QUOTE ]

1. While Howard originally taught Annie how to play, I highly doubt that Annie has been playing all this time with some of the best players in the game and didn't pick up a few things on her own or from talking with other pros.

2. If someone who learned their poker from a 2+2 book was able to put out the material in a form that was even easier for me to understand the concepts, then I'm pretty sure I would buy it. In fact, I believe Ed Miller's strength is that he is able to present his material in an easy to understand way. There are concepts in SSHE that I had read other places but still had not clearly grasped, but when I read SSHE, a light seemed to go off in my head.

Have you ever taken a class where you were unable to grasp the professor's lecture right away but when you discussed with a classmate, he was able to explain it in such a way that you immediately understood? Who did the better job of teaching you here, the professor (Howard) or the fellow student (Annie).

Apparently this whole thread is probably for nothing since according to the poster who read an advance copy is that the purpose of this book is not to teach but to entertain.

[BluffTHIS!]

[ QUOTE ]
I highly doubt that Annie has been playing all this time with some of the best players in the game and didn't pick up a few things on her own or from talking with other pros.

[/ QUOTE ]

Or peeking at their hole cards when she was not in the hand.

[ QUOTE ]
If someone who learned their poker from a 2+2 book was able to put out the material in a form that was even easier for me to understand the concepts, then I'm pretty sure I would buy it. In fact, I believe Ed Miller's strength is that he is able to present his material in an easy to understand way. There are concepts in SSHE that I had read other places but still had not clearly grasped, but when I read SSHE, a light seemed to go off in my head.
Have you ever taken a class where you were unable to grasp the professor's lecture right away but when you discussed with a classmate, he was able to explain it in such a way that you immediately understood? Who did the better job of teaching you here, the professor (Howard) or the fellow student (Annie).

[/ QUOTE ]

If someone can't understand more advanced material then how can they expect to beat bigger limits? And what are her qualifications for being able to explain it better?

[ QUOTE ]
Apparently this whole thread is probably for nothing since according to the poster who read an advance copy is that the purpose of this book is not to teach but to entertain.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm sure it will be entertaining.

[Depalma]

[ QUOTE ]
If someone can't understand more advanced material then how can they expect to beat bigger limits?

[/ QUOTE ]

Not all books are aimed at bigger limits and, whil I aim to play at bigger and bigger limits and you probably do as well. There are some out there who if they can play 3-6 or 4-8 at their local casino with their friends, they are happy and do not aim for anything more than that.

[ QUOTE ]
And what are her qualifications for being able to explain it better?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know if she is or not. As I said, I am willing to reserve judgement until she proves it one way or another. You'd rather make a judgment without any facts and just assume that she can't.

I guess we agree to disagree.

[BluffTHIS!]

[ QUOTE ]
You'd rather make a judgment without any facts and just assume that she can't.

[/ QUOTE ]

I could make that judgement regarding 90% of non 2+2 books and have a great probability of being correct without reading them.

[disjunction]

Annie Duke had some posts to this website that were pretty insightful, even though she was holding back. If she wanted to, she could prove better at explaining the numbers -- that is, she may be capable of venturing into (semi)-mathematical territory that Lederer can't, for fear of confusing people.

For most people's purposes it's not too important whether Annie Duke is one of the top 10 players in the world or in the top 200.

[Depalma]

[ QUOTE ]

I could make that judgement regarding 90% of non 2+2 books and have a great probability of being correct without reading them.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, on this point anyway, we can agree

[Ed Miller]

[ QUOTE ]
I mean, would anyone buy a poker book from someone who learned how to play from 2+2 books and then wrote their own book that didn't contain any new insight?

[/ QUOTE ]

I resent that. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Jordan Olsommer]

"Ed Miller : How I Raised, Folded, Bluffed, Flirted, Cursed, and Won Millions at the World Series of Poker "

Sounds about right. Although I reckon your flirting EV is probably not what it used to be, given your impending bachelorectomy. Godspeed, dude.

[Piers]

[ QUOTE ]
How I Raised, Folded, Bluffed, Flirted, Cursed, and Won Millions at the World Series of Poker

[/ QUOTE ]

I have not read it, but I am expecting it to live up??! to its title.

[BluffTHIS!]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I mean, would anyone buy a poker book from someone who learned how to play from 2+2 books and then wrote their own book that didn't contain any new insight?

[/ QUOTE ]

I resent that. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL. I know you are being facetious, but I only have purchased one of your books, GSIH, and only because I wanted to understand your short stack NL strategy since I play only big bet and need to understand all styles my opponents might play. However, it was not just a regurgitation of other 2+2 books, as your articles aren't either.

[bombazury]

Post deleted by deacsoft

[ECDub]

Johnny Chan said she sucks and he couldn't believe Hellmuth lost the TOC to her. Chan said she shouldn't have been there in the first place. I think she is a good player and although she initially learned the game from Lederer, she has kicked his butt a ton of times and has developed her own playing style. I thought her advanced dvd was well done and she was fairly generous with the information she revealed. As far as the book, I did not pick it up because I don't like biographical stuff, but I heard it was well done from a few people who picked it up back in the day.

[steamboatin]

I have it on CD and listen to it in the car. I like it. I thought the BIO stuff was interesting. I fast forward though it when I relisten but the tourney parts are fascinating to me probably because I am learning O/8.

[Aceshigh7]

[ QUOTE ]
In my opinion, the label overrated is the result of her being a popular figure but we cannot deny the fact that she is a very good player. Her accomplishments just speak for herself.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow, you bumped a thread more than a year old so that you could include a spam link. Impressive. Don't think i've seen that done before.

[Jack Bando]

Read this yesterday during work. (I work at a bookstore and can read when no customers are around.)

The even numbered chapters are her life story, which I didn't care to read. I wanted a book about a poker player. The advice she gives for poker is mainly for Omaha, since it's what she's playing at the WSOP in the odd chapters. The incorrect hand info was annoying. "A9TT is a bad hand in Omaha H/L since it gives you a weak low chance." Weak? Non-existant. There were some other errors, but that one stuck out themost. I'd guess there are at least 5 errors similar to that.

She rips on McManus in the WSOP 2000 flashback part, she rips on some "internet poster" (Daniel N.) and says part of the reason he stopped and said sorry is because he was threated to be blackballed (or something slightly weaker) from the WSOP.

Book was the worst non-poker strategy poker book I've read.