Reraising in position

[avfletch]

I've just been musing on the difference between playing suited connectors and small pps in position.

If you reraise in position then you increase your fold equity on the flop. This is good when you hold a suited connectors because you flop big draws about 1 time in 8. It is bad when you hold a pocket pairs because you flop big hands about 1 time in 8.

This implies that we get most value by reraising our suited connectors and flat calling our small pps.

Discuss.

[mrpotto]

Don't you mean with pockets we flop big hands 1 time in 11?

I generally call raises with 10-10 on down and reraise with JJ+. Not always though.

I tend to always fold scs when I'm not the orignally raiser but your thread gives me reason to pause (especially since I'm trying to open up my reraise range). The other thing that differentiates here is that hitting your set gives you a made hand and is generally well disguised. With scs your "only" flopping a draw and some times it will be obvious (although perhap not since people will tend to put on on over cards, big pockets if you reraised).

Good topic.

[avfletch]

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Don't you mean with pockets we flop big hands 1 time in 11?

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Chance of hitting a set on the flop holding a pair is 1 in 8.

2/50 + 2/49 + 2/48 = 6/49

[IceMuncher]

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Don't you mean with pockets we flop big hands 1 time in 11?


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You crossed your percentages and ratios. It happens about 10.8% of the time, for a ratio of 8.3:1 (not hitting set to hitting set), or 1 out of every 9.3 times.

[Gelford]

Basically the problem with your reasoning is this .... let us say for all simplicity that all your cbets win.

if playing 25NL you both usually put in 3$ each, so that is what you win. Eight times, so you end with 8x3=24$

Let us say you smoothcall 7 times and fold to a cbet ... then the last time you actually stack the dude, you you win 25-7=18$


Now there are a lot of other factors involved, like not staking villian the one time you hit a set or not winning with every cbet and you could also win all your cbet and stack with a set.


But basically there is something here already that gives you a feeling of 3 betting pairs being right. Also if you often threebet with different holding you are more likely getting action on your sets .... and another thing is getting good reads and actually winning showdown with your pocket pairs against overs

It is poker and blah blah a lot of factors, but basically I fell that your argument does not hold water.

[Sam Spade]

Are we talking full ring or 6 max?

[avfletch]

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Are we talking full ring or 6 max?

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Take your pick. Comment on either.

[Gelford]

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[ QUOTE ]
Are we talking full ring or 6 max?

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Take your pick. Comment on either. [/quote


Try replying to my post instead /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[avfletch]

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Are we talking full ring or 6 max?

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Take your pick. Comment on either.

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Try replying to my post instead /images/graemlins/wink.gif

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What can I say? I think you make very valid points.

The OP was just something that occured to me, not something I thought was right.

[redCashion]

[ QUOTE ]
I've just been musing on the difference between playing suited connectors and small pps in position.

If you reraise in position then you increase your fold equity on the flop. This is good when you hold a suited connectors because you flop big draws about 1 time in 8. It is bad when you hold a pocket pairs because you flop big hands about 1 time in 8.

This implies that we get most value by reraising our suited connectors and flat calling our small pps.

Discuss.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure I agree that bloating a pot to give you increased fold equity is a good idea. Alot of players, especially bad ones, are going to get alot more committed to a pot as it gets bigger. And if they were the original raiser, they likely have a pretty good starting hand and might be harder to shake loose now that you've increased the stakes.

I actually think reraising with SC in position is only a good idea if a guy is getting out of line, and you want to punish him for his wide raising range. But you are usually hoping for a preflop fold more than a huge pot and cbet on the flop.

I like calling in position with SC, because it opens up your opens on the flop. Depending on the texture of the board and your read on teh villain you can reraise him on the flop to take it down or give yourself a free turn card, float and try to take it away when he checks on the turn, play the hand quietly with a big draw and punish him when you hit, etc etc. My point is that I think the place to outplay your opponent is postflop so you want to give yourself the max options.

In a reraised preflop pot, a few bad things can happen. He can 4bet you preflop and blow you off the hand. He can call your cbet on the flop, even though you've missed and have no hand no draw. Once that's happened your only option is check/fold.

[Gelford]

I'm not sure I'm right either, that is why I promted for a response

I think the key is balance, you are not looking to only get paid off on monsters, but also more common stuff like onepair hands and it demands for you to be active as life as a nit is less fruitfull unless up against morons. And raising a lot and 3betting a wide range of hands is a way to do this.

Still it is a demanding style to play and can easily lead to spewing, reading is important etc. So better to be a profitable nit than a spewing lagtard. And you can make good money being a nit /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[avfletch]

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Still it is a demanding style to play and can easily lead to spewing, reading is important etc. So better to be a profitable nit than a spewing lagtard. And you can make good money being a nit /images/graemlins/smile.gif

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If I ever write a poker book I will put this in the introduction /images/graemlins/smile.gif