Good vs. Evil = Truth vs. Delusion

[J. Stew]

Agree or disagree . . .

[soon2bepro]

more like delusion vs truth /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[RJT]

I’ve often thought of the Adam and Eve/Eating the fruit story similarly. Once they ate the forbidden fruit we became “aware” of our surroundings. We kinda came from a dream/utopia-like state to a “reality”-like state. We are now trying to (ironically) find our way through the maze of reality to get back to the “Garden” (I think Crosby, Stills, Nash refers to this thought is their song “Woodstock”.) I say ironically because it is dreams that seems so confusing.

We (some of us) desperately are seeking answers through rational thought to find that dream-like state of Utopia that was once known before “the fall”.

[MidGe]

[ QUOTE ]
I’ve often thought of the Adam and Eve/Eating the fruit story similarly. Once they ate the forbidden fruit we became “aware”

[/ QUOTE ] of god lack of morals and able to criticise it.

Only a few elects have little dust in their eyes that prevent them from seeing the truth! /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[xorbie]

this seems like a really naive scientific definition. ive tried to argue along the same lines before... try to work it out yourself. it doesn't really seem to make it anywhere, especially when you get into epistomological questions.

[J. Stew]

Adam and Eve's an interesting story. It seems to me though, that Adam and Eve were already aware of their surroundings, then Adam ate from the tree of knowledge thus drawing mental boundaries on reality and creating suffering or delusion to the reality he was naturally aware of. As for rational thought, I think it has to be played delicately. It's the paradox, if you believe your thoughts to be truth, you become delusional when you attach to those thoughts, but if you don't believe your thoughts, or have the sense of self that produces rational thoughts, you become detached from life. Actually I think the state of Utopia they're talking about comes with becoming less and less attached to rational thought while still being able to maintain an 'on-point' mental aptitude. The letting go of ego without becoming attached to the feeling of letting go of ego (the hippy downfall) thing.

[J. Stew]

Do you think the propensity to have comparitively little dust in your eyes is a luck factor, do you think something somehow gets reincarnated in certain people, or do you think everybody has the innate ability to have little dust in their eyes.

[J. Stew]

I disagree, rationally, it takes you to the conceptual paradox which is basically what all the major religions fundamentally point to. Yeah dogma is bull but the thing which religion points to is legit; the thing they are trying to say. So if conceptually, you can rationally get to a realization about some fundamental truth about your existence, you can expand your awareness and understand more subtle aspects of reality.

That's basically where this heads. It looks at the web of thoughts that make the mind from an outside perspective. When you look at thoughts objectively, truthfully, you are not attached to them. From this outside-but-inside perspective, deeper truths are realized and then those relative truths are looked at objectively, even deeper truths are realized then, and consciousness is 'expanded'. Wisdom is cultivated in the process. The wisdom is the intellect, but how you get there is by not attaching to what you think is wisdom right now. By knowing that what you know is only a relative truth, you can continually have a balance between believing your thoughts to be truth and remaining unattached to them because fundamentally they are delusions. Blah blah, but I think it does go places, just in a not-only-conceptual, way. The meaning that creates the concepts is what it points to, which is the age-old question I guess.

[J. Stew]

Yeeeaaah.

[MidGe]

[ QUOTE ]
Do you think the propensity to have comparitively little dust in your eyes is a luck factor, do you think something somehow gets reincarnated in certain people, or do you think everybody has the innate ability to have little dust in their eyes.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know if it is a luck factor or just another example of the injustice in the world. As I have no reason to belive in the existence of a soul, or spirit, independent of the physical body, I cannot believe, really, that there is anything to be re-incarnated. I do see very clearly mechanism of cause and effects and how my actions could have very long term ramifications and therefore influence some other sometimes in the future. I cannot however acccess with any accuracy the complete set of results derived from amy single action. I therefore tend to focus on my intention and try not to put too much expectation on consequences.

[OrianasDaad]

I think if you look at everything that is regarded as "evil", you'll see some form of delusion/self-denial at the root.

I tend to agree.