50NL 6m: yet another TP2K fold?

[Jigsaws]

Villain unknown.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (6 handed) internettexasholdem.com (http://www.internettexasholdem.com)

MP ($38.10)
CO ($43)
Button ($31.30)
Hero ($54.55)
BB ($72.60)
UTG ($40.60)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP calls $0.50, CO calls $0.50, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $3</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP folds, CO calls $2.50.

Flop: ($7) A/images/graemlins/club.gif, J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 8/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $5</font>, CO calls $5.

Turn: ($17) T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, CO checks.

River: ($17) J/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">CO bets $12.5</font>, Hero folds?

[Marshall28]

id have bet the turn ... i know a lot of draws just came in, but not bettiing here is pretty much giving up on the hand. theres no way you can call his river bet, and it could easily be a bluff the way he played it ... but you beat almost nothing.

had you bet the turn he'd definitely know if u were beat, and if he didnt have a hand he'd fold.

[homeslice]

I think I call here, villian knows your scared of a flush. You've induced him to bet.

[eigenvalue]

I would bet the turn and check/fold the river if called. If I check the turn, I'm usually planning to call the river. But I would save this procedure for stronger holdings where I'm planning to induce a bluff.

After Your turn check, call that river bet. You accidentially induced a bluff and he may hang in there with a weak A. You may be surprised how often You win here after calling. He didn't show that much strength!

[Jigsaws]

What worse hands call a turn bet?

[ImprovinNewbie]

i dont check the turn, try another 1/2 pot bet. without the flush the CO cant call and you are still beating several aces and almost all middle and bottom pairs. chard weak aces, and middle pairs fold to a raise.

[Marshall28]

[ QUOTE ]
What worse hands call a turn bet?

[/ QUOTE ]

none ... but how can u justify calling the river if you check the turn? obviously you are checking because theres a good chance he could have just hit.

my only argument is that if u r calling this river, it would have saved you money to bet the turn as if he played back at you youd know you were beat.

[wslee00]

[ QUOTE ]
What worse hands call a turn bet?

[/ QUOTE ]
you can't apply this reasoning here. There are more cards to come and if you check the turn, you are
1) giving your opponent infinite odds if he has one diamond
2) allowing him to take the pot away from you w/ a bet on either the turn or river.

[Jigsaws]

If I bet $12.50 on the turn (I would most likely have bet more if I bet), how does that save me money as opposed to just calling this river bet?

[ QUOTE ]
1) giving your opponent infinite odds if he has one diamond

[/ QUOTE ]
This is a good reason to bet.

[ QUOTE ]
2) allowing him to take the pot away from you w/ a bet on either the turn or river.

[/ QUOTE ]
I was planning to check-call turn or river, then I saw that the river paired the J, and wasn't sure whether I should even bother calling river.

[Shaddux]

I would lead turn and c/f river.

By checking the turn, we are potentially inducing a bluff that we don't want to call.

[Marshall28]

[ QUOTE ]
If I bet $12.50 on the turn (I would most likely have bet more if I bet), how does that save me money as opposed to just calling this river bet?

[/ QUOTE ]

the FE you have is what saves you money.

why exactly do you want to check call turn and/or river?

[Shaddux]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If I bet $12.50 on the turn (I would most likely have bet more if I bet), how does that save me money as opposed to just calling this river bet?

[/ QUOTE ]

the FE you have is what saves you money.

why exactly do you want to check call turn and/or river?

[/ QUOTE ]
Usually this line is taken to control the pot and/or induce a bluff. I don't really like it here though.

[Marshall28]

actually im wrong, you wont save money

[Jigsaws]

I guess I just don't see why I'd lead the turn. If anything, I think the choice is between check-calling or check-folding the river.

[Shaddux]

If you think c/c on the river &gt; c/f, then I would rather fire 2nd barrel on turn and c/f river, rather than check turn, c/c river.

In this situation, if I am checking through the turn, I c/f river also. This might be the best play but I'm not sure.

[wingchunflush]

I think you lead the turn, if you get raised its an easy fold.

[NL Newbie]

I wonder what a player may think if he has say... A9 here and you bet flop/turn then check river.

Would he value bet thinking your bluffing meaning we sometimes fold best hand? if so does this occur often enough for checking turn/calling river to be profitable?

For this happen we need Bluffs+WeakAceValueBets &gt; flush value bets+JackSuckOuts+1cardflushsuckouts although we rarely pay off the latter.

Meh - I dont know what line is best i like to see rivers since i get annoyed if i think i folded best hand. Rather know i got sucked out on - plus its costs the same.

and in long run Jack dont hit here, so maybe other hands value bet/bluff us!

Chk turn call river /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[kurto]

I'm okay with the way you played it. There's only a straight, a flush, trips and boat possibilities out there.

[Shaddux]

After leading hard for two streets, I doubt that most players are going to try to pull a move like that on the river with A9.