Stating A and Not A

[DougShrapnel]

People like to be told the truth.
People like to be lied to.

Is it as simple as discerning when people like to be told the turth and when people like to be lied to. Or are people generally illogical with likes?

[madnak]

"Lied to" isn't the same as "not told the truth." And even if it were, your statements wouldn't represent A and not A. A and not A would be "All people like to be told the truth" and "Not(all people like to be told the truth)."

What you're saying is logically the following:

"Some people like to be told the truth sometimes."
"Some people like to be lied to sometimes."

The two statements aren't even in the neighborhood of being mutually exclusive.

[bkholdem]

[ QUOTE ]
People like to be told the truth.
People like to be lied to.



[/ QUOTE ]

People like to sleep.
People like to be awake.

People like to engage in fighting behavior.
People like to engage in peaceful behavior.

People like to like.
People like to dislike.

p.s. I do not mean this as an insult, but take a few courses in logic, philosophy, critical thinking, etc. I would highly recommend this to everyone.

[DougShrapnel]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
People like to be told the truth.
People like to be lied to.



[/ QUOTE ]

People like to sleep.
People like to be awake.

People like to engage in fighting behavior.
People like to engage in peaceful behavior.

People like to like.
People like to dislike.

p.s. I do not mean this as an insult, but take a few courses in logic, philosophy, critical thinking, etc. I would highly recommend this to everyone.

[/ QUOTE ]Yeah this was really bad, I was running bad, I had hoped it would die. I was attempting to make 2 points and failed misearbly. People aren't always logical when determining what they like. And that often people make false mutual exclusivity of terms. I could always take more logic, philosophy classes. Or I could just try to be more discerning when posting.

[vhawk01]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
People like to be told the truth.
People like to be lied to.



[/ QUOTE ]

People like to sleep.
People like to be awake.

People like to engage in fighting behavior.
People like to engage in peaceful behavior.

People like to like.
People like to dislike.

p.s. I do not mean this as an insult, but take a few courses in logic, philosophy, critical thinking, etc. I would highly recommend this to everyone.

[/ QUOTE ]Yeah this was really bad, I was running bad, I had hoped it would die. I was attempting to make 2 points and failed misearbly. People aren't always logical when determining what they like. And that often people make false mutual exclusivity of terms. I could always take more logic, philosophy classes. Or I could just try to be more discerning when posting.

[/ QUOTE ]

From personal experience, the former is much easier.

[oneeye13]

this is not A and not A

[DougShrapnel]

[ QUOTE ]
this is not A and not A

[/ QUOTE ]Yes that's true. Do people use logic to determine if they like A?

[DougShrapnel]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I could always take more logic, philosophy classes. Or I could just try to be more discerning when posting.

[/ QUOTE ]

From personal experience, the former is much easier.

[/ QUOTE ] In difference on which one is more rewarding?

[Philo]

[ QUOTE ]
"Lied to" isn't the same as "not told the truth." And even if it were, your statements wouldn't represent A and not A. A and not A would be "All people like to be told the truth" and "Not(all people like to be told the truth)."

What you're saying is logically the following:

"Some people like to be told the truth sometimes."
"Some people like to be lied to sometimes."

The two statements aren't even in the neighborhood of being mutually exclusive.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are correct in pointing out that "lied to" and "not told the truth" are not the same thing. But, the convention in logic (Aristotelian, syllogistic) is to read "People like to be lied to" as "All people like to be lied to," and it would be illicit to add the quantifier 'some'.

[madnak]

It would have to be "all people like to be lied to all the time." I don't think that's what Doug meant.

[bkholdem]

Doug meant people like to be lied to not all the time but some of the time

Doug did not mean people do not like to be not lied to some of the time

[madnak]

[ QUOTE ]
Doug did not mean people do not like to be not lied to some of the time

[/ QUOTE ]

But if he meant that people like to be told the truth some of the time, that must have implied this, no?

[bkholdem]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Doug did not mean people do not like to be not lied to some of the time

[/ QUOTE ]

But if he meant that people like to be told the truth some of the time, that must have implied this, no?

[/ QUOTE ]

Did he know at the time he made the statement that said statement would be interpreted as suggesting he implied that some people like to not be told the truth some of the time?

[madnak]

I assume that he assumed his statement would be interpreted as he intended it, so I assume that he knew that his statement would be interepreted as suggesting he implied that some people like to not be told the truth some of the time.

[bkholdem]

[ QUOTE ]
I assume that he assumed his statement would be interpreted as he intended it, so I assume that he knew that his statement would be interepreted as suggesting he implied that some people like to not be told the truth some of the time.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol you win!

[quinn]

[ QUOTE ]
People like to be told the truth.
People like to be lied to.

Is it as simple as discerning when people like to be told the turth and when people like to be lied to. Or are people generally illogical with likes?

[/ QUOTE ]

If A = People like to be told the truth
Then not A = It's not the case that people like to be told the truth

[Philo]

[ QUOTE ]
It would have to be "all people like to be lied to all the time." I don't think that's what Doug meant.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think it's what he meant either, but what he actually wrote is parsed that way. (I once had a student who asked me if I could grade him on what he meant to write rather than what he actually wrote!)

[madnak]

I have a teacher who'd call my writing on this forum terrible due to the frequent disregard for the mechanics of the English language.

I'd just say it's an informal environment, so I don't care what kind of grade I'd get.