$200 NL, confused with AQ facing action...

[TheMetetron]

God I was so lost here...

UTG was 69/0/1.2 over 50 hands

SB was 48/6/2.2 over 60 hands

No other reads. Going to be posting this in parts over the next hour or so.

Party Poker ($2 no limit). Hand converted by Check Raised hand converter (http://www.checkraised.com/site/apps/hh/index.php)

UTG ($138.35) (UTG)
CO ($215.25) (CO)
SB ($266.24) (SB)
HERO ($242.33) [ http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/aced.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/queenh.gif ] (BTN)
BB ($199.20) (BB)
MP ($50.75) (MP)

Preflop (6 players):
UTG calls ($2.00) [2.5:1].
2 folds.
<u>HERO raises $9.00.</u>
SB calls ($8.00) [2.75:1].
BB calls ($7.00) [4.14:1].
UTG calls ($7.00) [5.14:1].

Flop (18 bets ($36) in pot, 4 players):
http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/aces.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/7d.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/8c.gif
SB checks.
BB checks.
UTG bets $30.30.
<u>HERO .....</u>

[ajmargarine]

No shame in letting this go right on the flop IMO. It's 4-way, which to me is the main reason to let it go. He led strongly into you, there may be a c/r lurking, it's liable to get messy. Fold, wait for a better spot.

[RunyonAve]

My line would be to raise this flop and fold to a 3-bet then then check the turn or fold to a big donk bet.


Edit: i'm just not giving the blinds any credit at this point for a hand that beats me.

[TheMetetron]

Okay, other thoughts?

[oyvindgee]

Would the word "fold" put me down in history as ridicilously weak tight? There is one draw and two sets he could to this with. In addition a range of Ax hands you are like breakeven against. Have you seen him leading into preflop raiser before?

[RunyonAve]

Other thoughts would be that he limped UTG with 77, 88, A7s or A8s and you're far behind, or he's got a weaker ace which i'm more inclined to believe.

[MatthewRyan]

UTG aka huge donk leads on A high flop after limping, I'll raise here, Im not folidng this hand here when he only has $130. Also, I raise to get this [censored] heads up.
raise to $75

If you get c/r by sb or bb you can fold tho.

[TheMetetron]

<u>HERO calls ($30.30) [3.19:1].</u>
SB calls ($30.30) [4.19:1].
BB folds [4.19:1].

Turn (63.45 bets ($126.9) in pot, 3 players):
http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/aces.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/7d.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/8c.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/6c.gif
SB bets $50.00.
UTG folds [3.54:1].
<u>HERO ....</u>

Now what the hell just happened?

[RunyonAve]

As played, i fold it here.

[oyvindgee]

Definitely fold now, your hand just became worthless.

[MatthewRyan]

Ur done onthe turn, you needed to raise of fold flop for this reason (everyone has wonderful odds to call with draws)

[TheMetetron]

[ QUOTE ]
Ur done onthe turn, you needed to raise of fold flop for this reason (everyone has wonderful odds to call with draws)

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay then you all definitely hate me.

<u>HERO calls ($50.00) [4.54:1].</u>

River (113.45 bets ($226.9) in pot, 2 players):
http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/aces.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/7d.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/8c.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/6c.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/aceh.gif
SB bets $70.00.
<u>HERO calls ($70.00) [5.24:1].</u>

How big of a fish am I?

[RunyonAve]

[ QUOTE ]
How big of a fish am I?

[/ QUOTE ]
Dont know? Did you suck out or did SB have a monster? Either way your swimming in the pond. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[oyvindgee]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
How big of a fish am I?

[/ QUOTE ]
Dont know? Did you suck out or did SB have a monster? Either way your swimming in the pond. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

That card didn't help him against any hand besides 67 or 78 and sb has neither. but since you thought you ace was good on turn, you just got better odds so you can't fold now.

[kitaristi0]

I should fold the flop but I never do. You're in a multiway pot with a hand that might be best but which is unlikely to improve whereas everyone else may be drawing very live or already have you crushed with someone else showing aggression, just muck it on the flop. And yet, click goes the call button.

[bobman0330]

I think the flop call is fine, but you really need to fold the turn. What could he possibly have that would lose?

[SEABEAST]

I call the flop quickly and then fold to unimproved turn bet.

I bet most turns if checked to and expect to be good a lot of the time.

[thejoe1989]

UTG is very loose preflop so a7 and a8 are both well within his rage, and with his aggressiveness so low and the fact he is leading into the pfr, folding seems to be the best option.

[MatthewRyan]

[ QUOTE ]
I call the flop quickly and then fold to unimproved turn bet.


[/ QUOTE ]

LOL - ya good idea, if the turn doesnt bring an ace (doesnt even help much) or queen we're done.

This is [censored] terrible.

Also - for everyone saying the flop call is OK, how about stating WHY

[bilbo-san]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I call the flop quickly and then fold to unimproved turn bet.


[/ QUOTE ]

LOL - ya good idea, if the turn doesnt bring an ace (doesnt even help much) or queen we're done.

This is [censored] terrible.

Also - for everyone saying the flop call is OK, how about stating WHY

[/ QUOTE ]

Against many players it is correct to call a flop bet but fold to a turn bet UI, simply because many players will not second barrel unless they can beat TP.

The UTG in question is a prime example. Given how he played, you had him beat.

I think a flop call is fine, because donks like this almost always slowplay a monster, so this is very often a weak lead.

On the turn I would fold because SB very likely hit 2-pair.

[Mackerel]

Personally, I don't like calling on the flop, because it gives any draws behind you much too good of odds to get there, and folding is just too weak.

I'd raise to about $80 to weed out the draws, and be done with it to further action.

Mack

[oyvindgee]

I'm amazed that a pot sized donk bet is perceived as a weak lead. I think we are crushed on this flop almost always and the times UTG doesn't have us we still have to face the blinds.

[bilbo-san]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm amazed that a pot sized donk bet is perceived as a weak lead. I think we are crushed on this flop almost always and the times UTG doesn't have us we still have to face the blinds.

[/ QUOTE ]

69% VPiP villains almost always play tricky-trappy with monsters, and lead weak.

[bobman0330]

You understand that the guy who's betting the turn is a different player than the one who bet the flop, right? That's critical.

[TheMetetron]

[ QUOTE ]
You understand that the guy who's betting the turn is a different player than the one who bet the flop, right? That's critical.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah and the guy betting the turn had 99. The other dude obviously folded so I don't know what he had. I won a massive pot but I felt like a huge donk while doing so. The problem I had was once I called the turn I couldn't now fold that river, but I think I called the turn out of just being plain confused. Bad idea in the long run I think though results oriented thinking is fun.

[2Paul2]

I think you played this fine.

Flop is a call. Nothing else makes any sense. There aren't tons of draws out there and you usually have the best hand.

Turn call/fold is pretty close. Your still ahead of AJ/T but could now be behind to a turned 2pair/straight. I think a call w/ plans of folding to a big river bet is ok though.

River you have to call. You have outdrawn some 2pairs, he could easily be value betting a weaker Ace and he is giving you a great price.

Paul

[SEABEAST]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I call the flop quickly and then fold to unimproved turn bet.


[/ QUOTE ]

LOL - ya good idea, if the turn doesnt bring an ace (doesnt even help much) or queen we're done.

This is [censored] terrible.

Also - for everyone saying the flop call is OK, how about stating WHY

[/ QUOTE ]

Because bets that don't make sense often don't make sense for a reason. People have air here all the time, or superweak semibluff stuff like 89 etc. Hence I call quickly, and if he still has the audacity to fire big again on the turn, then I am comfortable letting it go. This is a staple play for me in this type of spot and it works very well. People bet all sorts of rubbish on one street but not two.

p.s. your posts are not very good and it would do you well to stop LOLing and keep an open mind, seriously

[JCCARL]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Ur done onthe turn, you needed to raise of fold flop for this reason (everyone has wonderful odds to call with draws)

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay then you all definitely hate me.

<u>HERO calls ($50.00) [4.54:1].</u>

River (113.45 bets ($226.9) in pot, 2 players):
http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/aces.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/7d.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/8c.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/6c.gif http://www.checkraised.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/aceh.gif
SB bets $70.00.
<u>HERO calls ($70.00) [5.24:1].</u>

How big of a fish am I?

[/ QUOTE ]

Garden variety calling station in this hand. I also like to raise or fold on the flop. Raising the flop gives you control of the betting for later streets. If it does't slow Villain down I probably fold the turn.
Regards,
Carl