Is anyone else not that worried?

[Variance God]

I'm primarily a high stakes limit player playing on UB, full tilt, stars, absolute, etc...

These sites don't seem to be in very much trouble. Not saying I'm happy with the bill but for some reason I'm not nearly as upset as the rest of you.

Casual gamblers will still be able to deposit on at least some of these sites. The majority of people I play with are at least somewhat established gamblers and aren't the type that will deposit 5K, try to run i up, lose it all, and never come back. Many of them are also serious enough about playing to find ways to deposit or they live in europe somewhere.

Can someone tell me why I should be (more) worried than I am? I want to know what's coming so I can be prepared.


Also, wouldn't it be easy to fake an address, etc? Or perhaps I could fly to some country in Europe, get a PO Box there, and set that up as my foreign address for the sites?

There seem to be so many ways for me as the customer to relieve the burden of the gambling sites. So should my worry be that the casual american won't bother anymore?

[heater]

[ QUOTE ]
So should my worry be that the casual american won't bother anymore?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is my biggest concern.

[viper930]

-Stars is very likely cutting off the US

-Casual gamblers WONT be able to deposit

-You should be worried unless you are braindead because the sites have announced that they're cutting off the US.

-It would be impossible for you to fake an out of country address without them wanting you to fake it and intentionally letting it slide.

-If you consider moving to another country a very simple and easy alternative then do it.

[MasterLJ]

Joe-six pack is the reason this game is profitable.

Whether he deposits $100 and blows it to other fish who eventually get to your level, or deposits $100, runs it up to $10,000 and blows it, he is exactly why you are able to make a living off of poker.

[Variance God]

[ QUOTE ]
-It would be impossible for you to fake an out of country address without them wanting you to fake it and intentionally letting it slide.

-If you consider moving to another country a very simple and easy alternative then do it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you misunderstood my paragraph.

[Variance God]

[ QUOTE ]
Joe-six pack is the reason this game is profitable.

Whether he deposits $100 and blows it to other fish who eventually get to your level, or deposits $100, runs it up to $10,000 and blows it, he is exactly why you are able to make a living off of poker.

[/ QUOTE ]


I guess this is partially true. On some days, I sometimes see a fish who bought in for 300 at 30/60, ran it up to 500 and went to 50/100, etc etc etc, until he suddenly hits every hand and is sitting with 20K at a 300/600 table.

On most other days, I just see my same old same old fish, slowly losing his bankroll, then waiting till the next month when he can redeposit again.


These people have gone through the trouble to set up Neteller. Don't you think they'll go through a little bit more trouble to set up another intermediary?

[MasterLJ]

No, because now it carries the strong possibility of audit and laundering charges.

If the IRS sees tons of unreported money funnelling into your American account from a foreign account you can pretty much expect to end up in a Pound-You-In-The-Ass prison.

[Variance God]

[ QUOTE ]
No, because now it carries the strong possibility of audit and laundering charges.

If the IRS sees tons of unreported money funnelling into your American account from a foreign account you can pretty much expect to end up in a Pound-You-In-The-Ass prison.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't really understand your point. Why wouldn't you report your money? Based on the discussion I've read, they couldn't arrest you for it.

[MasterLJ]

Because if you used some "workaround", i.e. depositing money through an overseas bank it would be supplying money for something that is domestically illegal. If you report it, it would be akin to a drug dealer reporting his revenue. I'm no lawyer and hope to God I'm wrong, but that's what it looks like on the surface.

[New001]

[ QUOTE ]
No, because now it carries the strong possibility of audit and laundering charges.

If the IRS sees tons of unreported money funnelling into your American account from a foreign account you can pretty much expect to end up in a Pound-You-In-The-Ass prison.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't understand, why would the IRS care as long as you're reporting your winnings and paying them?

[MasterLJ]

Let me give an intuitive explanation... Do you guys think that in the spirit in which the bill was intending, that the Federal government would say that using a foreign bank to fund poker transfers would be kosher? If that were the case all you'd have to do is have some Euro-Neteller service that accepts money from Americans and there would be virtually no change in the status quo.

Furthermore, the law specifically criminalizes the transfer of any EFT/Check/Wire/ANY PROCEEDS to an online gambling site. To me, that says they do not care how it is worked around, it is illegal for any site to take an American's money. So the only way you could transfer money from a foreign source would be by claiming that you are a citizen of a different country (fraud).

[Variance God]

[ QUOTE ]
Let me give an intuitive explanation... Do you guys think that in the spirit in which the bill was intending, that the Federal government would say that using a foreign bank to fund poker transfers would be kosher? If that were the case all you'd have to do is have some Euro-Neteller service that accepts money from Americans and there would be virtually no change in the status quo.

[/ QUOTE ]


Exactly. It seems that the government wants to stop online gambling sites from taking in money from US sources--not to prevent US citizens from playing poker. I know it doesn't make much sense, but WE aren't the target here at all.

[MasterLJ]

This is true. As many have said, it doesn't seem like any American will be arrested for playing online poker, but you may run into cases where you simply can't get your money out. I know what you're saying, and I hope you're right but I just can't see the IRS being OK with you claiming your winnings funnlled in from an offshore account. Somewhere along the chain an American bank will have to process proceeds from online gambling, which is expressly illegal under the wording of the law. They make no mention of how the money eventually gets to the bank, but taking the extra step of using an offshore account is literally, by definition, laundering the money to make it able to clear an American bank, which, imo, could land an American online poker player in jail.

[mrhat187]

IRS doesn't share you information with other governmental sources......It's illegal just FYI /images/graemlins/wink.gif.

[oreopimp]

Even if sites are still around, the issue of getting money to and from them seems like it could be an issue. At least from the statments coming out.

[MasterLJ]

[ QUOTE ]
IRS doesn't share you information with other governmental sources......It's illegal just FYI /images/graemlins/wink.gif.

[/ QUOTE ]

I honestly did not know that. Not even laundering, etc? I mean, would you still sleep well at night basically admitting you are doing something illegal, and a department of the government knows about it? I wouldn't.

[New001]

As I've always been told, the IRS doesn't care where you got your money from as long as they get the amount they want. I don't know exactly how true that is in practice, but it seems to be at least mostly true.

[TheMetetron]

I'm chilling.

[MasterLJ]

[ QUOTE ]
As I've always been told, the IRS doesn't care where you got your money from as long as they get the amount they want. I don't know exactly how true that is in practice, but it seems to be at least mostly true.

[/ QUOTE ]

If it were true that the IRS doesn't care where the money comes from, just that they get their share, why would money laundering even exist? You'd have nothing to fear even if you ran a drug cartel.

[Viscant]

This is true. You could say that you sold crack on the street and as long as you reported your income properly, the IRS won't tell anyone and you're good to go.

However, requiring that people pay taxes on something that's already illegal is frequently just a way to bust them for not paying taxes on that activity...then nailing them for that activity when they have them. See also, Al Capone. Or for a more hilarious example...the pimp tax.
http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/06/27/pimp.tax/index.html

[New001]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
As I've always been told, the IRS doesn't care where you got your money from as long as they get the amount they want. I don't know exactly how true that is in practice, but it seems to be at least mostly true.

[/ QUOTE ]

If it were true that the IRS doesn't care where the money comes from, just that they get their share, why would money laundering even exist? You'd have nothing to fear even if you ran a drug cartel.

[/ QUOTE ]
I might not fear the IRS, but I might fear other government agencies.

[MasterLJ]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
As I've always been told, the IRS doesn't care where you got your money from as long as they get the amount they want. I don't know exactly how true that is in practice, but it seems to be at least mostly true.

[/ QUOTE ]

If it were true that the IRS doesn't care where the money comes from, just that they get their share, why would money laundering even exist? You'd have nothing to fear even if you ran a drug cartel.

[/ QUOTE ]
I might not fear the IRS, but I might fear other government agencies.

[/ QUOTE ]

Someone else stated that the IRS cannot, by law, share information with other government agencies. While I will give the benefit of the doubt and believe that this law might be on the books, I am highly skeptical that this is true in reality.

[fishbutt]

I believe there is a drug clause of some sort in the tax laws...the IRS cannot turn you in for anything aside from selling drugs. just keep in mind, the IRS has unchecked power when it comes to screwing up your life...don't mess with the IRS! if you're gonna play illegally, i would still claim the money as "other" or something. i'm not a law-professional...but this is what one of my profs told his class.