casino whoring question from a n00b

[ShakeZula06]

I'm thinking about getting into casino whoring and was wondering a few things.

Looking at Casino Dave's website I see the first casino for cashable blackjack bonus on the list is Starluck, $100 deposit, $100 bonus, $1,600 wagered.

What is the normal wagers that people make on these? I figured I'd just bet $1 to have a low RoR but 1600 wagers seems like an awful lot.

So what is your normal wager? What has been your approximate hourly rate? how much variance is usually involved?

Thanks a lot for any help,
Ben

[skierdude1000]

If you're starting, do $1 best. I've done like 5 casinos now with minimum wagers and my hourly rate is like $25-30 and VERY little variance.

If you wanna make money at this, you need discipline and patient.

I do about 400 hands per hour, so 1600 took me 4 hours.

[ATB13]

zzzzzzzzzzzzzz.......flat betting $1 will get boring. Get your gamble on! How about flat betting $4? You get it done 4x as fast with the same EV...(actually slightly higher I think).

[Homer]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm thinking about getting into casino whoring and was wondering a few things.

Looking at Casino Dave's website I see the first casino for cashable blackjack bonus on the list is Starluck, $100 deposit, $100 bonus, $1,600 wagered.

What is the normal wagers that people make on these? I figured I'd just bet $1 to have a low RoR but 1600 wagers seems like an awful lot.

So what is your normal wager? What has been your approximate hourly rate? how much variance is usually involved?

Thanks a lot for any help,
Ben

[/ QUOTE ]

Standard Deviation is 1.15*(bet size)*sqrt(#hands). For example, if you bet $5/hand, SD = 1.15*5*sqrt(1600/5) = $103. What this means is you'd have to run about 1 SD below EV to lose money, which is about a 1-in-6 shot. In other words, with a $5 bet size, you have a 5/6 chance of making money. As far as ROR is concerned, I'd have to dig out my formulas. They are in the archives, though.

[ShakeZula06]

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If you're starting, do $1 best. I've done like 5 casinos now with minimum wagers and my hourly rate is like $25-30 and VERY little variance.

If you wanna make money at this, you need discipline and patient.

I do about 400 hands per hour, so 1600 took me 4 hours.

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting, also another thing i was thinking about is mutlitabling or playing two sites at the same time. Is the software slow enough to make this a good idea? Anyone try it?

[Homer]

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If you're starting, do $1 best. I've done like 5 casinos now with minimum wagers and my hourly rate is like $25-30 and VERY little variance.

If you wanna make money at this, you need discipline and patient.

I do about 400 hands per hour, so 1600 took me 4 hours.

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting, also another thing i was thinking about is mutlitabling or playing two sites at the same time. Is the software slow enough to make this a good idea? Anyone try it?

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No, there is no multitabling when it comes to casino whoring.

[Ken_AA]

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If you're starting, do $1 best. I've done like 5 casinos now with minimum wagers and my hourly rate is like $25-30 and VERY little variance.

If you wanna make money at this, you need discipline and patient.

I do about 400 hands per hour, so 1600 took me 4 hours.

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting, also another thing i was thinking about is mutlitabling or playing two sites at the same time. Is the software slow enough to make this a good idea? Anyone try it?

[/ QUOTE ]

haha, why dont you jsut try one and find out for yourself.

Ken

[Ad Alta]

How large you bet when clearing this bonus should depend on your bankroll. If you only have ~500 or something, bet a buck or two. If you have 10k, feel free to bet $25 or $50/hand.

[ShakeZula06]

That seems a little to conservative. When I was playing on starluck I got up to about $8 or so betting a $1, so I started betting $2 with the stipulation that if I dropped back to even I'd go back to $1. Once I got u to about +$24, I started betting $3 a hand and so on. Luckily I hit a nice rush and at one point was up $120. The concept is that I can clear my bonus much faster this way and keep m RoR fairly low since even if I drop all the way to even (not including bonus) I can just go back to betting $1.

Thoughts on this strategy?

[jba]

"So what is your normal wager? What has been your approximate hourly rate? how much variance is usually involved?"

$25/hand usually, sometimes up to 50 or 100. ~190/hr. I have BUSTOD a little over 50% of the time.

[Ken_AA]

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If you wanna make money at this, you need discipline and patient.



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Actually, that lowers your EV.

Ken

[kyleb]

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If you're starting, do $1 best.

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*slits wrists*

[ShakeZula06]

Another question-

Casino on net seems really slowed down by the stupid messages like you win, bust, etc. Is there anyway Im not seeing to turn these off?

[ImsaKidd]

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If you're starting, do $1 best. I've done like 5 casinos now with minimum wagers and my hourly rate is like $25-30 and VERY little variance.

If you wanna make money at this, you need discipline and patient.

I do about 400 hands per hour, so 1600 took me 4 hours.

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting, also another thing i was thinking about is mutlitabling or playing two sites at the same time. Is the software slow enough to make this a good idea? Anyone try it?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, there is no multitabling when it comes to casino whoring.

[/ QUOTE ]

I multitabled two really slow sites one time. It is pretty hard though- take your time to not make mistakes.

[ShakeZula06]

did the first 3 casinos on casino dave's site, made $400 in about 6 hours. My basic strategy has been to bet $2/hand, and increase my betting higher for a limited shot take, and stay up if variance doesnt smack me in the head. I've made $54 betting wise.

hourly rate for bonus-$67/hr
hourly rate total- $76/hr
total wagered-$7,200
betting ROI- + 0.75%

playing perfect bj, what is your edge? I'd imagine its in the 97-99% range, so I'm running a little good. Of course, a few $15 wagers go the other way and I'm running right around expectation.

mods- i have no affliation with either casino dave or any casino. If you think I'm mentioning either too much, deleting the parts where I do mention them will be no problem.

[skierdude1000]

If you want to gamble, listen to the other guys. Flat betting $1 a hand is the most sure way to make money doing this. I treat it like investing and the #1 rule from my boy Graham is to preserve capital -- defensive investing. You want to keep as much of your Bankroll as possible. At least that's how I do it and I've been successful.

[Brice]

How is betting $1 going to raise your EV as opposed to $5 or even $10 a hand?

[Ken_AA]

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If you want to gamble, listen to the other guys. Flat betting $1 a hand is the most sure way to make money doing this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your EV for any particular bonus is exactly the same no matter what you bet (assuming you leave yourself money to double and split every hand).

Your long term EV goes up the higher you bet, but so does your varience. Its up to you how you want to look at it.

Ken

[skierdude1000]

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If you want to gamble, listen to the other guys. Flat betting $1 a hand is the most sure way to make money doing this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your EV for any particular bonus is exactly the same no matter what you bet (assuming you leave yourself money to double and split every hand).

Your long term EV goes up the higher you bet, but so does your varience. Its up to you how you want to look at it.

Ken

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He's a noob. High variance may wipe out his bankroll if he's just starting out

[Alex/Mugaaz]

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If you want to gamble, listen to the other guys. Flat betting $1 a hand is the most sure way to make money doing this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your EV for any particular bonus is exactly the same no matter what you bet (assuming you leave yourself money to double and split every hand).

Your long term EV goes up the higher you bet, but so does your varience. Its up to you how you want to look at it.

Ken

[/ QUOTE ]

I've never done casino whoring, but your bet size shouldn't have any effect on your EV. Unless you are talking about EV/Time.

[skierdude1000]

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If you want to gamble, listen to the other guys. Flat betting $1 a hand is the most sure way to make money doing this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your EV for any particular bonus is exactly the same no matter what you bet (assuming you leave yourself money to double and split every hand).

Your long term EV goes up the higher you bet, but so does your varience. Its up to you how you want to look at it.

Ken

[/ QUOTE ]

I've never done casino whoring, but your bet size shouldn't have any effect on your EV. Unless you are talking about EV/Time.

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We're talking Variance here. With higher bets, he's more likely to bust. He wants to build a bankroll here.

[Freakin]

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If you want to gamble, listen to the other guys. Flat betting $1 a hand is the most sure way to make money doing this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your EV for any particular bonus is exactly the same no matter what you bet (assuming you leave yourself money to double and split every hand).

Your long term EV goes up the higher you bet, but so does your varience. Its up to you how you want to look at it.

Ken

[/ QUOTE ]

I've never done casino whoring, but your bet size shouldn't have any effect on your EV. Unless you are talking about EV/Time.

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Your EV increases as your variance increases. Your average total WR decreases.

[skierdude1000]

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If you want to gamble, listen to the other guys. Flat betting $1 a hand is the most sure way to make money doing this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your EV for any particular bonus is exactly the same no matter what you bet (assuming you leave yourself money to double and split every hand).

Your long term EV goes up the higher you bet, but so does your varience. Its up to you how you want to look at it.

Ken

[/ QUOTE ]

I've never done casino whoring, but your bet size shouldn't have any effect on your EV. Unless you are talking about EV/Time.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your EV increases as your variance increases. Your average total WR decreases.

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So what happens when he busts on his first site because he thought his EV was higher? He's screwed with no bankroll. In the short-term, variance is more important than EV for someone who has a small bankroll and is just starting casino whoring.

[Freakin]

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If you want to gamble, listen to the other guys. Flat betting $1 a hand is the most sure way to make money doing this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your EV for any particular bonus is exactly the same no matter what you bet (assuming you leave yourself money to double and split every hand).

Your long term EV goes up the higher you bet, but so does your varience. Its up to you how you want to look at it.

Ken

[/ QUOTE ]

I've never done casino whoring, but your bet size shouldn't have any effect on your EV. Unless you are talking about EV/Time.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your EV increases as your variance increases. Your average total WR decreases.

[/ QUOTE ]

So what happens when he busts on his first site because he thought his EV was higher? He's screwed with no bankroll. In the short-term, variance is more important than EV for someone who has a small bankroll and is just starting casino whoring.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was not debating that a casino n00b should stick to very small bet sizes... I was correcting an incorrect assumption about betsize and EV

[db9db9db9]

http://suckout.blogspot.com/2004/12/beginners-guide-to-casino-bonuses.html

[ShakeZula06]

Since this thread became pretty popularI guess I'll post some of my points.

I disagree with the constant $1 bet thing. When he's saying betting big=bad, it's because he believes that I wont drop down to $1 if variance hits me upside the head. For instance, if Im up I'll be betting roughy 1/8 of how much I'm up. If I lose half my profits, Ill cut my wager in half. If I'm losing I won't ber over 2% of my total br on that site ($100 means $2 bet) and If for some reason I'm under $50 I'm of course betting $1).

This only increase my RoR a very very slim portion (probably less then 1/10th of a percent) however it juices up my hourly by multitudes. In other words any time I'm not betting $1 I'm taking a shot, and worse comes to worse I'm stuck in a mind numbingly boring $1/hand.

Blckjacks boring enough betting $5/hand, I'm not going to make 5x as many wagers for 5x smaller amount.

We are not computers we dont have to bet one amount the whole damn time, it would be incredibly mind numbinly horrible. I wouldnt wish it on my worse enemys.

[Alex/Mugaaz]

I must be missing something about how this works. Any game is played at x% HA. How does bet size change this?

[136913691369]

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I must be missing something about how this works. Any game is played at x% HA. How does bet size change this?

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use the search feature. There have been countless threads about it. In short, betting bigger allows you to bust out more decreasing the amount of -EV wagers that you have to place.

[db9db9db9]

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I must be missing something about how this works. Any game is played at x% HA. How does bet size change this?

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use the search feature. There have been countless threads about it. In short, betting bigger allows you to bust out more decreasing the amount of -EV wagers that you have to place.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, we all seem to know this is true. Although no one actually seems able to prove that this is true.

But there's something in the 2+2 archives that proves that this is true. Although nobody actually seems able to produce this smoking gun.

But we all know it's true.

[db9db9db9]

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I must be missing something about how this works. Any game is played at x% HA. How does bet size change this?

[/ QUOTE ]

use the search feature. There have been countless threads about it. In short, betting bigger allows you to bust out more decreasing the amount of -EV wagers that you have to place.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, we all seem to know this is true. Although no one actually seems able to prove that this is true.

But there's something in the 2+2 archives that proves that this is true. Although nobody actually seems able to produce this smoking gun.

But we all know it's true.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh, and news flash: 2+2's search function is almost useless.

[Freakin]

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I must be missing something about how this works. Any game is played at x% HA. How does bet size change this?

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use the search feature. There have been countless threads about it. In short, betting bigger allows you to bust out more decreasing the amount of -EV wagers that you have to place.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, we all seem to know this is true. Although no one actually seems able to prove that this is true.

But there's something in the 2+2 archives that proves that this is true. Although nobody actually seems able to produce this smoking gun.

But we all know it's true.

[/ QUOTE ]

it's not that complicated.

Lets say you start off a bonus by betting your whole balance on a 50/50 game. You will bust out 50% of the time.

You do a 100/100/2000 bonus 10 times

Your total wagers if you never busted out would be 20000.

Your expected loss from BJ would be about $100 (20000*.005)

If you bust out half the time after betting your whole balance on a 50/50 game, your total wagers would be 11000 (5*2000)+(5*200)

Your expected losses from 11000 of blackjack is $55 (11000*.005).

You saved $45 in EV by betting larger and decreasing your total average WR

[ebull]

Say you bet $1 / hand and bust 30% of time. Rest of time you make expected $99. 7 x 99 = $693 less $300 equals $393.

Betting whole balance means 50% bust and wins 5 x $99. 5x $99 = $495 less $500 equals -$5.

What am I missing? Assume wins of $150 / casino on non-bust hands and $250 in net profit. Looks like small bets and lower risk of ruin increases overall money netted from the bonuses (bonii??)