Helmet Laws

[FlFishOn]

I hate 'em. They are one of the very few things that allow for humanity to alter the gene pool. If you're not smart enough to wear a helmet then there exists some non-zero chance you won't live to reproduce, since most dead cyclists tend to be young.

Most all other avenues of natural selection have been closed. As a species we have the genetically unfit not only surviving, but reproducing, passing on inferior traits to future generations.

[madnak]

It's the fit who pass on their genes, by definition. Natural selection is as active now as it has ever been. And this belongs in politics.

[evolvedForm]

Are you saying Ben Rothelisberger is unfit?

[FlFishOn]

[ QUOTE ]
It's the fit who pass on their genes, by definition. Natural selection is as active now as it has ever been.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'll go for it. My concern is that many of the previous methods of selection are no longer operating and some of the ones now operating may be disadvantageous.

[luckyme]

[ QUOTE ]
I'll go for it. My concern is that many of the previous methods of selection are no longer operating and some of the ones now operating may be disadvantageous.

[/ QUOTE ]

Seems like a reasonable possibility but the example may not fit it. The 'gene' that may be eliminated would more likely be related to risk-taking than general intelligence. Eliminate it and we may end up a nation of accountants. Who would go to Mars? Guys like Feynman seem like helmut shuckers to me.

[Lestat]

I agree with your reasons, but have one more. I don't think governements should be making laws that tell citizens they HAVE to do something for their own good. Seat belts might be different, cuz you can hurt someone else in the car if you're not buckled in. But I can think of no one else you can hurt by not wearing a helmut. Therefore, it is an intrusion on personal rights by the state.

[Lestat]

[ QUOTE ]
It's the fit who pass on their genes, by definition. Natural selection is as active now as it has ever been. And this belongs in politics.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know. I think it falls under philosophy.

And I agree natural selection is alive and well, I wonder if survival traits aren't changing. There are many people who shouldn't have survived 1000 years ago, who thrive today. I guess that just means what we're evolving towards is changing.

[FlFishOn]

"...like Feynman seem like helmut shuckers to me. "

Maybe. But take a good look around at the next biker event you see.

[FlFishOn]

[ QUOTE ]
Are you saying Ben Rothelisberger is unfit?

[/ QUOTE ]

Who can say? Strikes me as not too bright.

[evolvedForm]

Dude, he gets more ass than gene simmons (relevant first name by the way). I know because I live in Pit and he goes to the local bars nightly bringing back college chicks. Takes them in his limo and they never know where they are going - his house is secret.

But I'm sure you knew he gets laid... a lot. The goal of evolution isn't smarts, it's propagation!

[FlFishOn]

"But I'm sure you knew he gets laid... a lot. The goal of evolution isn't smarts, it's propagation! "

Two questions.

You really think he's making babies across PA?

Who's sucking him off in surgery?

[evolvedForm]

[ QUOTE ]
You really think he's making babies across PA?



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The fact that he's getting laid a lot makes him fit. Darwin never said anything about contraceptives.


[ QUOTE ]

Who's sucking him off in surgery?



[/ QUOTE ]

I'm sure they're lining up. He's still worth millions.

[yukoncpa]

[ QUOTE ]
I agree with your reasons, but have one more. I don't think governements should be making laws that tell citizens they HAVE to do something for their own good. Seat belts might be different, cuz you can hurt someone else in the car if you're not buckled in. But I can think of no one else you can hurt by not wearing a helmut. Therefore, it is an intrusion on personal rights by the state.


[/ QUOTE ]

I agreed with everything you’re saying until I drove through Arizona; they don’t have helmet laws for anyone over the age of 18. The moment you enter Arizona, it’s as if everyone suddenly turns into a retard. My sample size is small, but it did seem as if 90% of motorcyclists were not wearing helmets. It was a striking dissimilarity to California. It made me wonder if indeed sometimes the state needs to step in to protect idiots from themselves.

[Lestat]

So if an idiot lays down his bike and dies because he wasn't wearing a helmut, that affects you how?

[Copernicus]

[ QUOTE ]
So if an idiot lays down his bike and dies because he wasn't wearing a helmut, that affects you how?

[/ QUOTE ]

If he lays down his bike in front of you and you hit him and he dies because of no helmet it affects you profoundly and for the rest of your life.

Anytime you expose yourself to greater risk that inherently involve another person, you are no longer making decisions strictly for yourself.

[morphball]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Are you saying Ben Rothelisberger is unfit?

[/ QUOTE ]

Who can say? Strikes me as not too bright.

[/ QUOTE ]

I bet he gets more chicks than you FlFishOn!

[Sack Lodge]

The population of people who would choose not to wear helmets and end up killing themselves on motorbikes is so small that it won't affect evolution one way or the other.

What worries me is that reasonable, intelligent, educated people are not reproducing at nearly the rate of the ignorant [censored].

[yukoncpa]

[ QUOTE ]
So if an idiot lays down his bike and dies because he wasn't wearing a helmut, that affects you how?



[/ QUOTE ]
Makes me feel sad for the idiot, especially if he's related to me.
Otherwise, I don't care, as long as these idiots have the wherewithal to pay for their own medical costs or are forced to buy extra personal injury insurance, so that I'm not forced into somehow paying for this idiot.

[madnak]

[ QUOTE ]
I guess that just means what we're evolving towards is changing.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, and that's a critical component of evolution many people miss. As the environment changes, so does the fitness of various traits. Evolution isn't about "making people smarter." Some of the fittest creatures in existence are single-celled organisms that haven't changed much in millions of years.

[madnak]

[ QUOTE ]
The 'gene' that may be eliminated would more likely be related to risk-taking than general intelligence. Eliminate it and we may end up a nation of accountants. Who would go to Mars? Guys like Feynman seem like helmut shuckers to me.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is an important point. Stupid behavior is often the result of tendencies that are necessary for human functioning. The behavior of not wearing a helmet may be related to any number of traits, including risk-aversion and desire for social acceptance and recognition. I'm guessing that in Arizona it's more socially acceptable to go without a helmet. In a real sense it may be better to risk death than to be seen as a coward or "uptight" person. This social stuff is what makes or breaks human organisms.

I'm smart and I'm talented at a number of things, but I'm socially inept and I can't get laid for the life of me. Am I more fit than the "dumb biker guy" with five girlfriends? No I'm not. Never will be.

[Lestat]

This is an interesting subject...

When I was a teenager, I was driving down a somewhat busy street and this beautiful big golden retreiver ran right out in front of my car. There was nothing I could do.

The owner came flying down the street in a rage screaming at me. He was a big guy and running full steam at me. Scary to say the least. When he got within 3 feet, I sidestepped him and knocked him cold with a pair of nun-chucks I always kept in my car. Now I really felt bad! The police came, it was a mess. Witnesses all sided with me, but I still wound up going to jail. None of it was my fault! This idiot is the one who was walking his dog without a leash. As a result his dog was dead and he was hospitalized for almost a week. I had huge legal expenses (or rather my parents did -lol), all because of his carelessness and then stupidity to not even realize who he should've been mad at.

I bring this up because I struggled with that day for a long while afterward. I finally decided that I shouldn't feel bad or guilty about any of it. And I'd feel the same way today if I hit motorcyclist and he died due to his own carelessness. But I do realize that a lot of people would be affected like I was when it first happened to me.

[Philo]

[ QUOTE ]
I hate 'em. They are one of the very few things that allow for humanity to alter the gene pool. If you're not smart enough to wear a helmet then there exists some non-zero chance you won't live to reproduce, since most dead cyclists tend to be young.

Most all other avenues of natural selection have been closed. As a species we have the genetically unfit not only surviving, but reproducing, passing on inferior traits to future generations.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hmmm...are you smart enough to wear a helmet in the shower?

[yukoncpa]

I was driving home from the bar after having drunk about 8 shots of bourbon and an equal number of beers. As I was about to turn into my drive, I made the mistake of lingering in the middle of the road for too long - my reflexes were a bit slow. Suddenly my truck shook and I heard a loud thump and a man went flying over my vehicle and landed in the middle of the road in front of me. Needless to say, I was in deep doodoo especially given that he wasn’t wearing a helmet.
The police showed up before I could even react, but much to my pleasant surprise, they cuffed the man - who by this time had dusted himself off with no apparent injury. The cops then thanked me for helping them apprehend a thief and were on their way.
Last time I ever drove drunk. Moral of the story: I would have been in big trouble if that moron had suffered a head injury.

[Lestat]

I'm not clear on what you did wrong.. Granted, you may have taken longer than normal to make the turn, but you still should've had the right of way, He plowed into you, right?

Anyway, funny how these things happen sometimes. I really felt terrible about that dog and still think about it.

[yukoncpa]

Yes, I had the right of way and he was speeding without his lights on and plowed into me. I'm just fortunate, the cop was too preoccupied to smell the odors waifting out of my cab. Had he done that, I'm quite certain he would have found a thing or two I was doing wrong.