Give Up on Full Tilt Bonus?

[chicagoY]

I've been playing winning limit and NL poker for about 2 years now. I've never lost at any site I've been at, but Full Tilt, probably the 9th I've tried, seems to be an exception. I've lost and lost and lost on it over the course of 10 K hands.

The numbers have been hilarious--at least to an impartial observor--as I seem to lose most confrontations regardless of the superiority of the cards I go in with. I won't bore you with any BBV stories but they're numerous.

At first, I was folding too much to extremely aggressive raisers who held practically nothing. This was totally on me as I didn't know anybody there and heard about FT's reputation for having solid players. Although, they have way more maniacs than UB for sure. These guys bluff way more than Harrington's 10 percent; more like 30 percent.

The reckless play should be very profitable long term for a TAP player, but, at least for now, I'm losing and losing.
I don't buy any of the "online poker is rigged" stuff and never have, but I'm wondering if the site just isn't for me even though I know this is just a very bad case of varience. Has anybody else had that happen where you feel like, regardless of how well others do, you just can't win somewhere?

I've done a little better since I have given up on 1/2 pot raising and continuation betting and increased it to full pot betting, but still the beats have been freakish. I've become more tight out of position than ever before but without the bonus I'd just keep plummeting.

I'm thinking about quitting and uninstalling the software for FT from my computer. I've cleared 250 of the bonus but, due to losses, remain even. I'll get some r--back at the end of the month which will help, but I've never seen anything like this and regardless of the limit I get trampled by clowns hitting a straight with a 2/8 offsuit (true story).

Anyway, is it dumb to give up while I'm even? I don't like the odds on sticking it out? Has anybody else ever quit in the middle of trying to clear a bonus? I feel like I'm leaving money on the table but these showdowns have been bizarre, in fact, the whole thing's been so unusual it's stopped me from tilting because its utter weirdness. Any similar situations for you?

[BigBiceps]

I love the Full Tilt interface. ....

I agree with the outdraws statement and have no further comment.

[Ted Metro]

Amazing...

Seriously, if you changed the name on your post to my name, about 90% of what you wrote is exactly what has happened to me.

I left Full Tilt, and at this time don't plan on ever returning. There are so many other bonus opportunities out there, I would suggest you leave.

[chicagoY]

That is amazing. Not to be Oprah, but thanks for telling me. I'm going to take your advice. I've still got about 500 waiting on UB to clear anyway.

[chicagoY]

Yeah, the software is just assume--when it doesn't lock up--no argument there and their store is priced fairly.

[chicagoY]

pardon, "awesome."

[thesanch]

100% totally agree with you. I've lost more in a shorter period of time than I have at any pokersite. I hate FT and am going to withdraw the remaining balance from there soon.

[scraggs]

i'm starting to notice the same thing chicago. i've only cleared $80 of my bonus but it seems like every board is an action board and every river is an action river. looks like it might be another absolute.

[NoMoreLurking]

I too am getting killed on FullTilt relative to other sites.

I have won consistently for 2 years at Party and Stars but 3 months on FT and I am down $250+ even with bonus.

I love the interface, love the competition(lots of people willing to put their money in with the worst of it), HATE the variance and suckouts.

If you are a winning player get out NOW, while you're not behind.

[scraggs]

also out of curiosity what limits are you playing chicago?

[chicagoY]

NL 25, 50, 100, 200. I try to practice good game selection with them. NL 400 is beyond my abilities right now. I'll give it a shot in July BR allowing.

[udbrky]

One thing I've noticed lately on FT is, I'd scout a table, and join it, then all of a sudden, the loose bad players aren't there anymore, and it's just a couple rocks (300 hands played against, 11% VPIP, etc.).

I pulled out of FT. I just don't have consistent success. I had KK against a guy who was on massive tilt - was playing some real crap, got stacked a couple times, he hit trips with a 5-7 and stacked me. I just decided the reload bonus was too long to endure, and the ups and downs weren't where I was best suited to play. I only played there here and there when I had consistent wins in a time frame.

[Wires]

You kids are all crazy.

I love the descriptive lengths to which you will go without dropping the "r"-bomb.

Say it and be free!

[scraggs]

[ QUOTE ]
You kids are all crazy.

I love the descriptive lengths to which you will go without dropping the "r"-bomb.

Say it and be free!

[/ QUOTE ]

Full Tilt poker is rigged. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[BigBiceps]

rigged ...

In 2006, 30,000+ hands of NL50 and NL100 and -$300.

I was crushing those games in 20,000 hands in 2005 and crushing those limits on the other sites.

[Longy]

I can't agree with the rigged stuff. Yes full tilt is a tough site im about break even after about 6 weeks if you don't include the bonuses. I consistently beat other sites so after they stop offering the bonuses im off to pastures new.

[Mossberg]

I signed up with rb there in early april and decided that I'd give the site a try and hopefully clear the bonus.. I wasn't a fan of UB at all, and AP just gives me a headache.. So i deposited 600$ and in the past month I've cleared 540 of the bonus, made 200 in rb, and won an additional 1800$ on top of all that..

That was mostly at 3/6 6max, and a little 5/10 6max when i was feeling good. The regulars there don't seem that good, and if your playing at the right times, you will come across some really fishy/maniac types.. I'm speaking from limited experience though, so i could be way off.

[HSB]

[ QUOTE ]
That was mostly at 3/6 6max, and a little 5/10 6max when i was feeling good. The regulars there don't seem that good, and if your playing at the right times, you will come across some really fishy/maniac types.. I'm speaking from limited experience though, so i could be way off.

[/ QUOTE ]

I find the same at the low NL tables.

[matrix]

FT is not rigged.

I've played there for 25K hands and constantly get nailed. I lose set over set - boat over boat - same as everywhere else.

I am also breakeven at FT but I think that it's down to me and not down to the site.

The players there play a different style and if you can't adapt and adjust to it and beat it you will lose - plain and simple.

Party IMO is much weaker opposition wise than FT. I know plenty of people that win there a lot.

I think everyone has a "natural game" and for some sites your natural game just isn't suited to the clientele. In this case if you can't win there but you can win elsewhere - then why stay?

A bad workman blames his tools. Mediocre poker players claim the site is rigged.


You could start this same thread about any other poker site and a few players will pipe up with "yes it's true - it's not really me - the flops are rigged for action" or some other crap. Take responsibility for your own actions/failings admit that you aren't good enough to beat the players at FT and get better or go play where you can win.

[Wires]

[ QUOTE ]
Take responsibility for your own actions/failings admit that you aren't good enough to beat the players at FT and get better or go play where you can win.

[/ QUOTE ]

Preach on, brother!

Well stated.

[chicagoY]

Very fine analysis. There's something about how they figure out their table percentages that's skewed.

[chicagoY]

I thought we weren't allowed to say it here?

[chicagoY]

That's great. I believe you guys and wish I had the same experience.

[chicagoY]

Well, I am adjusting to it but it's taken awhile. No, I never thought or said the site was rigged. Your comment about natural style is probably accurate. No, I would have to say I can beat the players over time because most of the ones at my levels are psychos. You have to be bankrolled though and can't worry as much about clearing a bonus as I have been.

[chicagoY]

The guys are starting to crack me up though because they all do something I call the FT Scam Play where you play a small pot against the clowns and then, by checking at the end, you induce the morons to throw their entire stack at you! They really do it.
Yes, somewhere they heard that this is a great move. I've started adapting and checking and it's been really funny when they Western Union me their stacks after my show of "weakness." Of course, it's taken me a week to figure this out so I hope the future will be better from here.

[KSOT]

I was thinking of signing up for Full Tilt really soon, but this topic scares me.

[HSB]

[ QUOTE ]
I was thinking of signing up for Full Tilt really soon, but this topic scares me.

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't let it.

ABsolute, now that's scary.

[udbrky]

I just think that there's too many people doing the same thing - looking for a good table, then it opens, and it's a bunch of TAGs sitting with each other. Maybe I'm wrong about that, but it seems like what I've found lately.

[scorer]

same experiences here..i wanna move on

[scraggs]

and why do so many of them overbet the pot by like 5%? wtf is that?

[scorer]

lol

[scorer]

bigbiceps, good enough for me. I thought it was just me losing there.

[scorer]

How many of you have seen this on full tilt....you have a pair of sixes and the flop comes 6/7/8...i have a set but.....turn brings a 10....lol

[Thoth]

[ QUOTE ]
The guys are starting to crack me up though because they all do something I call the FT Scam Play where you play a small pot against the clowns and then, by checking at the end, you induce the morons to throw their entire stack at you! They really do it.
Yes, somewhere they heard that this is a great move. I've started adapting and checking and it's been really funny when they Western Union me their stacks after my show of "weakness." Of course, it's taken me a week to figure this out so I hope the future will be better from here.

[/ QUOTE ]
You mean hands like these /images/graemlins/smile.gif
FullTiltPoker Game #624730375: Table Palamos (6 max) - $0.50/$1 - No Limit Hold'em - 10:11:54 ET - 2006/05/09
Seat 1: beardyian ($44.30)
Seat 2: Chesternuts ($47.55)
Seat 4: Jaws2u ($42.40)
Seat 5: Thoth73 ($114.95)
Seat 6: ZandB ($100)
Jaws2u posts the small blind of $0.50
Thoth73 posts the big blind of $1
ZandB posts $1
The button is in seat #2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Thoth73 [Qh Kd]
ZandB checks
Chesternuts folds
Jaws2u folds
Alaskan Kid sits down
Thoth73 checks
*** FLOP *** [2s 5d Qc]
Thoth73 bets $2.50
Alaskan Kid adds $20
ZandB calls $2.50
*** TURN *** [2s 5d Qc] [Ac]
Thoth73 bets $5
ZandB calls $5
*** RIVER *** [2s 5d Qc Ac] [Jc]
Thoth73 checks
ZandB bets $17.50
Thoth73 calls $17.50
*** SHOW DOWN ***
ZandB shows [6s 4c] (Ace Queen high)
Thoth73 shows [Qh Kd] (a pair of Queens)
Thoth73 wins the pot ($50.50) with a pair of Queens
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $52.50 | Rake $2
Board: [2s 5d Qc Ac Jc]
Seat 1: beardyian is sitting out
Seat 2: Chesternuts (button) didn't bet (folded)
Seat 4: Jaws2u (small blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 5: Thoth73 (big blind) showed [Qh Kd] and won ($50.50) with a pair of Queens
Seat 6: ZandB showed [6s 4c] and lost with Ace Queen high

[MicroBob]

All -

Huh???

Yup, I'm sure FT is rigged.
Thanks for participating in this wonderful thread and for letting all of us know.


P.S. - I'm about half-way through the bonus and am finally climbing back from my initial big-time downswing of beat after beat there.
I finally ran hot tonight though and made back a ton of it.
So I think they just unrigged it.


Scorer - you need to stop thinking that so many sites are rigged. I remember you comments about AP having too many aces, etc.
And now you are blaming full-tilt for your losses there?
Any other posts of other rigged-sites that you have found that I may have missed?

Can you guys just try to play winning poker and stop worrying about whether the cards are sufficiently randomized?

[matrix]

[ QUOTE ]

P.S. - I'm about half-way through the bonus and am finally climbing back from my initial big-time downswing of beat after beat there.
I finally ran hot tonight though and made back a ton of it.
So I think they just unrigged it.

[/ QUOTE ]

aha!

2 days ago I finally broke even at FT after clawing my back out of a huge initial downswing (caused mostly by my own terrible play no less)

Yesterday I played really well (by my standards) and got stacked set over set (twice) boat over boat and got sucked out on about 8 times by some shortstack - end of day result down 4 buyins.

I think that when they unrigged it for you they rigged it against me again /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

can I have my winrate back please? /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[matrix]

[ QUOTE ]
and why do so many of them overbet the pot by like 5%? wtf is that?

[/ QUOTE ]

It's called the "bet pot button"

I /images/graemlins/heart.gif the bet pot button.

[Uncle Wimp]

I wish this thread was around a year ago before I blew some money there. I've been a winning player everywhere but there also and have to fight the urge to give it another try each time they send me another reload email.

[Jabba Jaws]

Funny, your not alone, lost my stack on one too many set over sets for my liking.

The hand that really capped it for me was flopping a full house with top set of mid pp in a limped pot betting against a guy who was previously overbetting and pushing me off any hand I was in against him, thinking overbet the pot now, he did, I push, he shows flopped quads /images/graemlins/mad.gif made it my last and cashed out even.

[chicagoY]

Of course it's not rigged, but most of us haven't had time to figure that out after the huge Amway responsibilities you've placed upon us.

[chicagoY]

See, people wouldn't want to admit this, but reading all these comments has made me feel far better about things so THANKS!

[chicagoY]

I think that every huge fan of Phil Ivey will naturally be attracted to his site so you've got every clown, like in the commercial, immitating his big bluffs with garbage hands and they miss out on all the folds Ivey makes that aren't televised.

[Ted Metro]

I don't know why or how this conversation deteriorated to discussions of rigging and criticisms of people's play.

I am in the same situation as the original poster, I have had more trouble at Full Tilt than I have at Party, Stars, UB, Pokerroom, Ipoker sites, etc. etc. I don't think Full Tilt is rigged, instead it is likely tougher competition, a few bad decisions, and bad beats over a relatively smallish sample.

Coincidentally I just got PokerTracker 2 days ago, and maybe I would have fared better at FT if I had already been using PT and an overlay program...

There are so many promotions, like PSO, and bonuses that I have yet to do so I choose not to go back to Full Tilt, whose bonus is pretty crummy for a $50NL player like me any way.

[BigBiceps]

I like getting allin with KQ v JQ on a board of 9TJ.
Turn 9, river 9.

Other good ones, getting allin on the flop with 88 v AK on a board of 853.
Turn 4, river 2.

It is not enough, JJ v AK on a board of AJ5.
Turn Q, river T.

AA v AJo allin preflop, flop J turn J.

Also, it seems like pocket sixes are magic in cracking any overpair. I lost with AA, KK, QQ like this, and have cracked several overpairs myself with 66.

I have played a lot of hands, so of course this stuff will happen, but these are just a few examples.

[chicagoY]

Last night, I picked off three major "I have nothing but I'm betting big at showdown" bluffs so I finished up 70 bucks on the day. If I were Ed Miller I would have recognized the weird play and adjusted immediately but I am no
Ed Miller.

[tufat23]

in all honesty this isnt an uncommon problem. i have never played FTP myself, but on absolute and poker.com i get killed, whilst everywhere else i do extremely well. my answer was jsut to stop playing my 'boggy' sites.

[J_B]

Usually when *I* do that bad at a certain site it's due to being on Tilt on that site. For the longest time I was running bad at Party of all places. Just logging in to Party I'd go on tilt. That's likely what's wrong here.

[HSB]

[ QUOTE ]
and why do so many of them overbet the pot by like 5%? wtf is that?

[/ QUOTE ]

That's the bet pot button at work is what that is

[thedarknight]

10k of a freaking hands is nothing.
Go check out the QTIP post where he had a 50k hand downswing..so stop your B*tching. I also had a downswing at Full Tilt where I could not win, but I attributed it to my play and table selection not Full Tilt. The limit games are a little more straightforward that's wh you see "action" hands. If someone is playing with you, they have something. If you're getting called on the flop/turn...you better have at least top pair and a good kicker. This is generally the case a FT, more of a tight/passive style. I would even say it's "softer" than party because most of these guys give up on the flop, while Party there's always some ass who has to fight for everything.

[dlk9s]

I won at FT. I guess it's rigged for me.

[udbrky]

I don't think it's rigged - it cracks me up when players make those comments. I'm just saying I have a hard time winning consistently there. Plus, I decided to reduce and not be playing FT, UB, Party and Bodog. I'm just concentrating on clearing my Bodog bonus, then move on from there.

[chicagoY]

No b*tching, just solid analysis.
Today, I picked off another 4 or so "I've got nothing so here's an outrageous bet on the river"s. I'm up another 80 and am 2/3 back to start up with most of the bonus released as profit. It's not so bad. I'm think I'm really on to something though with this FT scam play as they all do it. They're incapable of betting a small or even medium sized pot. It's quite bizarre and I really think they're trying to emulate Phil Ivey or something else they saw on TV. They're like LAG mutations or something.

[MakesCents]

[ QUOTE ]
I won at FT. I guess it's rigged for me.

[/ QUOTE ]
Me too, we must be the bad players winning with 82o. Im not up huge or anything but I dont notice it being more or less rigged than any other site... imagine that.

[BigBiceps]

Whether you won or lost does not determine whether or not it is rigged.

[chicagoY]

Man, I got to post more often, I've made 50 more in the last two hours--figure in bonus and it might be XM radio time--just from calling dumb overbets on the river. They love that stuff on FT! I tapped the acquarium once though. I said,"Who would have thought that King high wouldn't have been good there?"

[thedarknight]

[ QUOTE ]
Man, I got to post more often, I've made 50 more in the last two hours--figure in bonus and it might be XM radio time--just from calling dumb overbets on the river. They love that stuff on FT! I tapped the acquarium once though. I said,"Who would have thought that King high wouldn't have been good there?"

[/ QUOTE ]

do you like looking at your results?

[scraggs]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
and why do so many of them overbet the pot by like 5%? wtf is that?

[/ QUOTE ]

It's called the "bet pot button"

I /images/graemlins/heart.gif the bet pot button.

[/ QUOTE ]

i didn't even see it on my screen when i played there. can you tell me where it was?

[scraggs]

[ QUOTE ]
in all honesty this isnt an uncommon problem. i have never played FTP myself, but on absolute and poker.com i get killed, whilst everywhere else i do extremely well. my answer was jsut to stop playing my 'boggy' sites.

[/ QUOTE ]

well absolute's just flat-out rigged so that isn't much of a surprise.

[chicagoY]

Is there anyone non-wealthy capable of not looking at results?
I thought my 500 would be poof and now I'm happy to have fought back. The bonus will be it for me though on FT.

[checkmate36]

If you don't win at a site it must be because its rigged. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[MakesCents]

[ QUOTE ]
Whether you won or lost does not determine whether or not it is rigged.

[/ QUOTE ]
Do you understand sarcasm?

[goodguy_1]

software seems slow and the layout sucks for PokerAce hud stats-too cramped

NLHE 6max games I've been playing have a higher PokerTracker ASF% than even Party but much smaller average pot size.

so many players are calling light pre-flop ...games seem pretty passive and fishy with decent game selection but the pots are small..havent really played alot there yet but I have datamined about 300K hands there.

bonus clear pretty quick at low/mid limits and up ie $3-6 LHE+ and $100/$200 NLHE+

games seem very sensitive to the time factor-games are really dead off peak hours in general seems like.