View Full Version : Dolphins respond to names
hmkpoker
05-09-2006, 10:04 AM
Link (http://tvnz.co.nz/view/page/488120/712051)
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"It's a very interesting finding that encourages further research, because they are using whistles as referential signals - that's what words are," said Sayigh, of the University of North Carolina Wilmington. "Dolphins appear to be using these arbitrary signals to identify another dolphin."
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Phil153
05-09-2006, 10:48 AM
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In nine out of 14 cases, the dolphin would turn more often toward the speaker if it heard a whistle that sounded like a close relative's.
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http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/6523/lollercoaster7ew.gif
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It's a very interesting finding that encourages further research
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Unfortunately, "follow the money" no longer applies just to politics.
Ibuprofen
05-12-2006, 10:31 AM
My dog responds to a name, doesn't make her special. Sorry, I just don't see what the big deal is about dolphins. Everything people point out about how smart dolphins are my dog can do.
Philo
05-12-2006, 11:07 PM
The title of the thread is misleading. The article doesn't just say that dolphins respond to names, it says that dolphins actually use names to refer to one another. Quite remarkable actually, I don't think your dog does that.
ColdCaller
05-13-2006, 02:29 AM
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My dog responds to a name, doesn't make her special. Sorry, I just don't see what the big deal is about dolphins. Everything people point out about how smart dolphins are my dog can do.
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Oh, is that so? Your dog [censored] uses sonar to locate objects?
Jesus christ you're an idiot.
vhawk01
05-13-2006, 03:17 AM
well, maybe not that, but my dog routinely kills sharks.
Andrew Karpinski
05-13-2006, 03:22 AM
Man thinks he is smarter than dolphins because he builds cities, conquers the planet, enslaves other species and builds war machines.
Dolphins think they are smarter than man for the same reasons.
Dolphins also have larger brain mass to body-mass ratios than humans--I think only dolphins and perhaps one species of whale hold that distinction.
Between different species of mammals, the comparative brain mass to body mass ratio is generally well-correlated with intelligence. Examples: Cats are smarter than sheep; cats also have a higher brain mass to body mass ratio than sheep. Pigs are (perhaps surprisingly) smarter than dogs; pigs have a higher brain mass to body mass ratio than dogs.
Those who argue that dolphins cannot be as smart or smarter than humans because dolphins have not produced similar outward accomplishments are perhaps missing something. Firstly, dolphins do not have prehensile hands. Secondly, their environment and lifestyle does not necessitate that they develop physical tools in order to live and succeed. Thirdly, they get to romp and swim and play and communicate with each other, have only limited natural enemies which they are well adapted to fend off, and apparently have no trouble finding enough food for themselves. They also do not need any shelter other than the ocean itself. So what incentive would there be for them to "build things", or to strive for domination of resources?
It looks like they get to play a great deal. They might have an advanced language (no definitive opinions yet on this, but researchers have not been able to conclude that they do not). They might have more time for play and love and learning than do most humans, and time to philosophize as well (if they are so able). They don't appear to fight amongst themselves much (if at all?), and generally seem very good-natured. The ocean is their giant playground, and the only major danger to them are humans with their several-miles-long tuna nets which can snag and drown dolphins. But mankind may eventually kill itself off anyway in which case that danger would disappear for dolphins.
Dolphins may not be as smart as humankind--or they might be smarter. We just can't know at this point. A significantly higher brain-mass/body-mass ratio is not automatically dismissable. Many more neurons (and probably pathways) means something, at least.
We also don't hear of any psychotic aggressive dolphins, even in captivity. Maybe they are just a nicer, less f'ed-up species than humans.
Getting to swim and play a lot more would be nice, too.
In my next life, I plan to be a dolphin.
Copernicus
05-13-2006, 09:22 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Dolphins also have larger brain mass to body-mass ratios than humans--I think only dolphins and perhaps one species of whale hold that distinction.
Between different species of mammals, the comparative brain mass to body mass ratio is generally well-correlated with intelligence. Examples: Cats are smarter than sheep; cats also have a higher brain mass to body mass ratio than sheep. Pigs are (perhaps surprisingly) smarter than dogs; pigs have a higher brain mass to body mass ratio than dogs.
Those who argue that dolphins cannot be as smart or smarter than humans because dolphins have not produced similar outward accomplishments are perhaps missing something. Firstly, dolphins do not have prehensile hands. Secondly, their environment and lifestyle does not necessitate that they develop physical tools in order to live and succeed. Thirdly, they get to romp and swim and play and communicate with each other, have only limited natural enemies which they are well adapted to fend off, and apparently have no trouble finding enough food for themselves. They also do not need any shelter other than the ocean itself. So what incentive would there be for them to "build things", or to strive for domination of resources?
It looks like they get to play a great deal. They might have an advanced language (no definitive opinions yet on this, but researchers have not been able to conclude that they do not). They might have more time for play and love and learning than do most humans, and time to philosophize as well (if they are so able). They don't appear to fight amongst themselves much (if at all?), and generally seem very good-natured. The ocean is their giant playground, and the only major danger to them are humans with their several-miles-long tuna nets which can snag and drown dolphins. But mankind may eventually kill itself off anyway in which case that danger would disappear for dolphins.
Dolphins may not be as smart as humankind--or they might be smarter. We just can't know at this point. A significantly higher brain-mass/body-mass ratio is not automatically dismissable. Many more neurons (and probably pathways) means something, at least.
We also don't hear of any psychotic aggressive dolphins, even in captivity. Maybe they are just a nicer, less f'ed-up species than humans.
Getting to swim and play a lot more would be nice, too.
In my next life, I plan to be a dolphin.
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Do you know if they exhibit any awareness of death such as mourning, burial at sea, or other rituals?
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[ QUOTE ]
Dolphins also have larger brain mass to body-mass ratios than humans--I think only dolphins and perhaps one species of whale hold that distinction.
Between different species of mammals, the comparative brain mass to body mass ratio is generally well-correlated with intelligence. Examples: Cats are smarter than sheep; cats also have a higher brain mass to body mass ratio than sheep. Pigs are (perhaps surprisingly) smarter than dogs; pigs have a higher brain mass to body mass ratio than dogs.
Those who argue that dolphins cannot be as smart or smarter than humans because dolphins have not produced similar outward accomplishments are perhaps missing something. Firstly, dolphins do not have prehensile hands. Secondly, their environment and lifestyle does not necessitate that they develop physical tools in order to live and succeed. Thirdly, they get to romp and swim and play and communicate with each other, have only limited natural enemies which they are well adapted to fend off, and apparently have no trouble finding enough food for themselves. They also do not need any shelter other than the ocean itself. So what incentive would there be for them to "build things", or to strive for domination of resources?
It looks like they get to play a great deal. They might have an advanced language (no definitive opinions yet on this, but researchers have not been able to conclude that they do not). They might have more time for play and love and learning than do most humans, and time to philosophize as well (if they are so able). They don't appear to fight amongst themselves much (if at all?), and generally seem very good-natured. The ocean is their giant playground, and the only major danger to them are humans with their several-miles-long tuna nets which can snag and drown dolphins. But mankind may eventually kill itself off anyway in which case that danger would disappear for dolphins.
Dolphins may not be as smart as humankind--or they might be smarter. We just can't know at this point. A significantly higher brain-mass/body-mass ratio is not automatically dismissable. Many more neurons (and probably pathways) means something, at least.
We also don't hear of any psychotic aggressive dolphins, even in captivity. Maybe they are just a nicer, less f'ed-up species than humans.
Getting to swim and play a lot more would be nice, too.
In my next life, I plan to be a dolphin.
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Do you know if they exhibit any awareness of death such as mourning, burial at sea, or other rituals?
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No idea. I think I've read that elephants do perhaps?
cambraceres
05-13-2006, 12:03 PM
Mourning, burial rituals, and the like do not neccessarily mean that there is an awareness of mortality as such. Instinct causes animals to do many things, some of them mimmick rational actions. The fact that a dog will run from a bear does not mean he realizes what the ultimate result of not running will be.
I have read about the mourning elephants that MMMMMM mentioned, but found nothing definitive.
Very interesting question!
Cam
madnak
05-13-2006, 12:50 PM
The major assumption that I take issue with is that intelligence is some quantifiable over-arching attribute. I would bet quite a bit that dolphins are smarter than humans in some ways, and not as smart in others.
tomdemaine
05-13-2006, 01:58 PM
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The major assumption that I take issue with is that intelligence is some quantifiable over-arching attribute. I would bet quite a bit that dolphins are smarter than humans in some ways, and not as smart in others.
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But which would you rather have on your pub quiz team?
Hopey
05-13-2006, 03:23 PM
Meh. Not all Dolphins are all that bright.
http://images.tsn.ca/images/stories/20050725/williams_52842.jpg
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The major assumption that I take issue with is that intelligence is some quantifiable over-arching attribute. I would bet quite a bit that dolphins are smarter than humans in some ways, and not as smart in others.
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Could be. OK.
Now how about the relative intelligence of:
- humans versus cows?
- humans versus monkeys?
- monkeys versus cows?
- dogs versus butterflies?
madnak
05-13-2006, 04:37 PM
You'd need to set a standard. Obviously by most mental standards humans are going to rank higher than cows. That doesn't mean intelligence is just one big "thing."
How about sheep versus cows? Butterflies versus snails? Cats versus octopi?
Peter666
05-13-2006, 11:28 PM
I always wondered why some people were so strangely fascinated by dolphins, trying to prove their intelligence and what not. Then the answer hit me: Dolphin fetish
http://www.sexwork.com/family/dolphinrape.html
website nsfw
Borodog
05-13-2006, 11:36 PM
Dolphins kill porpoises for sport.
Borodog
05-13-2006, 11:41 PM
Oh, yeah, and they also "murder" young dolphins so that they can [censored] their moms.
Peaceful, gentle souls!
Interesting, I had never heard of either of those things. Do you have a link, Borodog? I'd be interested to read more.
Borodog
05-14-2006, 12:37 AM
http://www.fishingnj.org/artdolphagress.htm
Fascinating article; thanks, Borodog.
Borodog
05-14-2006, 01:07 AM
You sir are welcome sir.
hmkpoker
05-14-2006, 01:27 AM
Grizzly bears do it too. (http://www.bioone.org/perlserv/?request=get-abstract&doi=10.2192%2F1537-6176(2005)016%5B0141%3ASSIIGB%5D2.0.CO%3B2)
vhawk01
05-15-2006, 05:27 AM
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Oh, yeah, and they also "murder" young dolphins so that they can [censored] their moms.
Peaceful, gentle souls!
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A lot of animals do this. It makes practical sense. The female will be better able to care after your genes if she isnt hampered by all these 'inferior' genes.
hmkpoker
05-15-2006, 02:16 PM
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Oh, yeah, and they also "murder" young dolphins so that they can [censored] their moms.
Peaceful, gentle souls!
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A lot of animals do this. It makes practical sense. The female will be better able to care after your genes if she isnt hampered by all these 'inferior' genes.
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Do you really think that's what's going through a dolphin's head when he kills the young? Or do you think he's thinking "hey, doing this will help me get laid!"
vhawk01
05-15-2006, 04:31 PM
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Oh, yeah, and they also "murder" young dolphins so that they can [censored] their moms.
Peaceful, gentle souls!
[/ QUOTE ]
A lot of animals do this. It makes practical sense. The female will be better able to care after your genes if she isnt hampered by all these 'inferior' genes.
[/ QUOTE ]
Do you really think that's what's going through a dolphin's head when he kills the young? Or do you think he's thinking "hey, doing this will help me get laid!"
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What do I really think? I think some dolphins happen to like to kill young that isnt theirs. And, having this proclivity gives a reproductive advantage, so the progeny of dolphins like this are more likely to do it. I dont think that the dolphin thinks this will help him get laid at all, actually. The two actions dont really seem immediately linked.
jokerthief
05-15-2006, 04:36 PM
I hate dolphins, they are always so damn happy.
hmkpoker
05-15-2006, 05:26 PM
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What do I really think? I think some dolphins happen to like to kill young that isnt theirs. And, having this proclivity gives a reproductive advantage, so the progeny of dolphins like this are more likely to do it. I dont think that the dolphin thinks this will help him get laid at all, actually. The two actions dont really seem immediately linked.
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Dolphin kills young.
Lack of young makes mother more open sexually.
Killing dolphin nails former mother.
What a coincidence.
Copernicus
05-15-2006, 05:57 PM
do they cringe and hide in the kelp forest when their nagging wife dolphin calls their name?
atrifix
05-15-2006, 06:06 PM
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What a coincidence.
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Coincidences do not a science make.
Copernicus
05-15-2006, 06:42 PM
Dateline:
Hollywood, May 15, 200
Universal Pictures has commenced filming of Caribbean Dolphin Bottlenose Massacre. This feature film, starring the corpse of Jacques Cousteau and introducing Gunnar Mammil as FlipperFace, tells the story of a deranged cetacean that wreaks havoc on the local school.
Expected to be released in time for the 2007 celebration of the Year of the Dolphin.
vhawk01
05-16-2006, 07:47 AM
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What do I really think? I think some dolphins happen to like to kill young that isnt theirs. And, having this proclivity gives a reproductive advantage, so the progeny of dolphins like this are more likely to do it. I dont think that the dolphin thinks this will help him get laid at all, actually. The two actions dont really seem immediately linked.
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Dolphin kills young.
Lack of young makes mother more open sexually.
Killing dolphin nails former mother.
What a coincidence.
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I understand what happens. I just dont think thats whats going through the dolphins mind when they kill the young. I guess I don't really know for sure but complex cause and effect relationships seem to be lost on most animals. Perhaps dolphins are different in this respect, and you are right.
hmkpoker
05-16-2006, 11:31 AM
It's not that complex. You want to nail a hot dolphin mama, there's something in your way. You don't like that something. You want to destroy that something. That something is the child, you kill it, and now mama is available.
CORed
05-16-2006, 04:52 PM
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Grizzly bears do it too. (http://www.bioone.org/perlserv/?request=get-abstract&doi=10.2192%2F1537-6176(2005)016%5B0141%3ASSIIGB%5D2.0.CO%3B2)
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Off the top of my head, I believe that males of these animals are known to kill the offspring of other males: Bears (grizzly and black, possibly other species) lions, domestic cats. I'm sure this list is incomplete. It's not unusual. Ihadn't heard that dolphins do it before.
vhawk01
05-17-2006, 04:57 AM
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It's not that complex. You want to nail a hot dolphin mama, there's something in your way. You don't like that something. You want to destroy that something. That something is the child, you kill it, and now mama is available.
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But I think they do it independently of immediately nailing the hot dolphin mama. I think they just happen to be inclined to kill young that aren't theirs. The fortuitous outcome of this is that there are likely to be more females around that are now receptive to mating, but its not like the baby is literally blocking the dolphins vagina.
vhawk01
05-17-2006, 05:17 AM
By the way...DO NOT do a google search on dolphin vagina, if you immediately wondered, "Do dolphins actually have those?" You will not like the results. Suffice it to say, dolphins are mammals, not fish, so they should have vaginas, not cloaca. I have to go wash out my eyeballs now...
madnak
05-17-2006, 10:53 AM
Wow. The first result for "dolphin vagina" is pretty interesting. Maybe I should head out to the beach more often.
vhawk01
05-17-2006, 12:58 PM
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Wow. The first result for "dolphin vagina" is pretty interesting. Maybe I should head out to the beach more often.
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I'm pretty sure I explicitly warned you not to look up dolphin vagina! /images/graemlins/blush.gif
Seriously though, thats messed up.
Borodog
05-17-2006, 05:12 PM
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By the way...DO NOT do a google search on dolphin vagina, if you immediately wondered, "Do dolphins actually have those?" You will not like the results. Suffice it to say, dolphins are mammals, not fish, so they should have vaginas, not cloaca. I have to go wash out my eyeballs now...
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DAMN YOU. YOU HAD TO BRING THIS UP, DIDN'T YOU?
PS. That is the among the most wrong of the wrongest things I have ever wished I had not discovered on the internet.
Phil153
05-17-2006, 06:18 PM
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PS. That is the among the most wrong of the wrongest things I have ever wished I had not discovered on the internet.
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lol, not even close.
Borodog
05-17-2006, 06:24 PM
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PS. That is the among the most wrong of the wrongest things I have ever wished I had not discovered on the internet.
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lol, not even close.
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I am but an innocent in the disgusting ways of the world.
hmkpoker
05-19-2006, 12:18 AM
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PS. That is the among the most wrong of the wrongest things I have ever wished I had not discovered on the internet.
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lol, not even close.
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I am but an innocent in the disgusting ways of the world.
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Do not click this link. (http://www.thefetus.net/page.php?id=1448)
vhawk01
05-19-2006, 10:25 AM
Harlequin babies are gross, but if you want to go down the road of medical horrors, do a little research on Lithopedia.
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